Scab Umpires

[Ump2323]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Yesterday was a dark day in Toledo Mud Hens baseball. The Mud Hens opened defense of their 2005 International League Championship yesterday evening losing at home to the Charlotte Knights, 1-0. But that is not what made it a dark day. It was dark because scab umpires officiated the game. The umpires names were not announced or shown in the box score, but an article in today The (Toledo) Blade stated that the umpires were amatuer umpires hired by the IL. The scabs should be ashamed of themselves.

MTD, Sr.

Theres nothing sad about a a union going on strike and having to find replacements. It happens all the time. It wasnt long ago that the MLB umpire went on strike was it sad to see the scab minor league umpires calling the games. I dont think so

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Gentlemen, gentlemen?

Since I am the person that started this thread I am going to take it upon myself to get it back on track. Yes, I use the word scab; and JIGGY correctly defined a scab, the word that I used in my origianl post.

That definition of scab is the point I am making. The umpires that are taking the place of the striking umpires are unprofessional and unethical. I know that is a very strong statement to make but it is true, nonetheless. I know if an incident in a fast pitch softball tournament last year, where the tournament director came onto the field while the game was in progress and stopped the game to complain to the plate umpire for tossing a coach who lost control of himself when his pitcher was penalized for quick pitching. The tournament director was told to leave the field by the PU. Instead he pushed the PU and swore at him. This was done if front of the BU and all of the spectators watching the game. The PU walked off the field, but his BU refused to leave the field and an unpire would had a game off gladly took the PU's place so he could make another game fee.

Yes, scab is a fighting word, but it what the replacement umpires are doing make them worthy of being called a scab and I cannot possibly have any respect for them when they gladly stab a fellos sports official in the back just so that they can earn some "big" money and have a memory of their big chance.

MTD, Sr.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Gentlemen, gentlemen?

Since I am the person that started this thread I am going to take it upon myself to get it back on track. Yes, I use the word scab; and JIGGY correctly defined a scab, the word that I used in my origianl post.

That definition of scab is the point I am making. The umpires that are taking the place of the striking umpires are unprofessional and unethical. I know that is a very strong statement to make but it is true, nonetheless. I know if an incident in a fast pitch softball tournament last year, where the tournament director came onto the field while the game was in progress and stopped the game to complain to the plate umpire for tossing a coach who lost control of himself when his pitcher was penalized for quick pitching. The tournament director was told to leave the field by the PU. Instead he pushed the PU and swore at him. This was done if front of the BU and all of the spectators watching the game. The PU walked off the field, but his BU refused to leave the field and an unpire would had a game off gladly took the PU's place so he could make another game fee.

Yes, scab is a fighting word, but it what the replacement umpires are doing make them worthy of being called a scab and I cannot possibly have any respect for them when they gladly stab a fellos sports official in the back just so that they can earn some "big" money and have a memory of their big chance.

MTD, Sr.

It's not TRUE, Mark. It's your OPINION. There's a difference. And your story is completely unrelated to the MiLU situation.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Rich Fronheiser

It's not TRUE, Mark. It's your OPINION. There's a difference. And your story is completely unrelated to the MiLU situation.

Rich:

My story is related to the both the MLB strike and the Minor League strike, and that is there are far too many sports officials who will sell out their brethen their own personal gain. People with integrity will not do that. Would I love to officiate in the NBA or WNBA? Sure, what basketball official wouldn't. But I would never cross a picket line or sell out my fellow basketball officials. (POI: So that people do not accuse me of witholding information, I have one friend who officiates in the NBA and two that officiate in the WNBA; My father was a member of the United Brotherhood of Carpenters Union for 53 years and his brothers were members of the United Steel Workers Union for over forty years.) Yes, I have a union background, but even if I did not have three friends that officiate in the NBA and WNBA I would sell out my fellow sports officials for fame or fortune.

MTD, Sr.

[jwwashburn]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Yes, scab is a fighting word, but it what the replacement umpires are doing make them worthy of being called a scab and I cannot possibly have any respect for them when they gladly stab a fellos sports official in the back just so that they can earn some "big" money and have a memory of their big chance.

MTD, Sr.

Mark,

It is incredible that a smart guy like you cannot understand that you lose so many listeners when you insult and call names. A lot of people will not listen to you, even if you are right. It seems like union rhetoric is not meant to persuade.

Instead, why don't you try a reasoned and respectful argument? Some of the guys who have worked Minor League games may see your point and refuse to do any more. Some guys who are undecided may be swayed in your direction.

Joe

[JIGGY]

Originally Posted by jwwashburn

Mark,

It is incredible that a smart guy like you cannot understand that you lose so many listeners when you insult and call names. A lot of people will not listen to you, even if you are right. It seems like union rhetoric is not meant to persuade.

Instead, why don't you try a reasoned and respectful argument? Some of the guys who have worked Minor League games may see your point and refuse to do any more. Some guys who are undecided may be swayed in your direction.

Joe

I try very very hard to give people the benefit of the doubt...but it is getting hard to believe that there is any intelligent life out there...

I HATE REPEATING MYSELF...

Calling them scabs is not name calling the same way that calling a Cop a Cop, or a Crackhead a Crackhead is not name calling. Whether you or anyone else likes the term, it is the correct title. The Crackhead's name is Pookie, but his title is Crackhead.

...And again with the "there's no difference between a guy off the street in a blue shirt and the minor league guys" crap? Anyone who makes ignorant statements like that simply proves the opposite to be true. You don't know what you don't know; on a professional baseball field, that can get you in a lot of trouble. This has already started to prove true for the Scabs and will only get worse before there is a resolution to this. The gap is immense. That doesn't mean that amateur guys aren't good people, or even good amateur umpires, it just means they aren't on the level at that level. Some of us need to realize we really couldn't win a game of one on one with Michael Jordan. It's a great fantasy but, as much as we would like to compare ourselves to him, ("I've got 10 fingers and toes too...") we would not even be worth his time it would take to embarrass us. A blue shirt doesn't make you an umpire, and being good at one level doesn't make you even qualified at the next.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by jwwashburn

Mark,

It is incredible that a smart guy like you cannot understand that you lose so many listeners when you insult and call names. A lot of people will not listen to you, even if you are right. It seems like union rhetoric is not meant to persuade.

Instead, why don't you try a reasoned and respectful argument? Some of the guys who have worked Minor League games may see your point and refuse to do any more. Some guys who are undecided may be swayed in your direction.

Joe

Joe:

Who did I insult? Who did a call a name? I thought using professional and ethical conduct as a reason for not crossing a picket line good and logical reasons for my position.

MTD, Sr.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Joe:

Who did I insult? Who did a call a name? I thought using professional and ethical conduct as a reason for not crossing a picket line good and logical reasons for my position.

MTD, Sr.

You used the term “scab” in the title of this thread. That is too much for guys like Joe to handle.

Peace

[PWL]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Joe:

Who did I insult? Who did a call a name? I thought using professional and ethical conduct as a reason for not crossing a picket line good and logical reasons for my position.

MTD, Sr.

Mark,

Don't worry about this fool. That's right Joe, I called you a name. I'm glad you live in an Utopia when everything in life is fair and just. People that cross picket lines to work are just that, low life, bottom feeder, scumbag, SCABS. You can slice it and dice anyway you want, but when you put the puzzle back together again you get the same picture.

Why do you think the AMLU went on strike, JoJo? Because the powers that be at PBUC care about their employees. Not hardly. Just because you don't understand the union mindset and the brotherhood. I should know, because I spent my entire working career dealing with labor/management issues. I have yet to see management ever come to a bargaining table even remotely to bargain in good faith. Nine out of ten times, their original proposals include cuts in benefits and cost of living raises, etc.

So, if a little name calling is too harsh for you I suggest you not read anymore of these quips from posters with strong opinions. You seem to be so easily offended.

If they wanted to replace the striking umpires they should have put this ad in the paper.

WANTED POTENTIAL MAJOR LEAGUE UMPIRES. PEOPLE WITH LITTLE OR NO EXPERIENCE. MUST BE WILLING TO TRAVEL. STARTING PAY, MINIMAL. SOME BENEFITS. LOW PER DIEM. MUST BE ABLE TO HANDLE STRESSFUL SITUATIONS AT ALL TIMES. DEALING WITH UNREASONABLE PEOPLE A MUST. MUST PAY FOR OWN UNIFORMS AND EQUIPMENT. NO OVERTIME. COMPLETE KNOWLEDGE OF RULES AND MECHANICS NECCASSARY. IF INTERESTED CALL BR5-49 FOR MORE DETAILS ON HOW YOU CAN BECOME BIG LEAGUE MATERIAL.

[jwwashburn]

Originally Posted by PWL

Mark,

Don't worry about this fool. That's right Joe, I called you a name. I'm glad you live in an Utopia when everything in life is fair and just. People that cross picket lines to work are just that, low life, bottom feeder, scumbag, SCABS. You can slice it and dice anyway you want, but when you put the puzzle back together again you get the same picture.

Why do you think the AMLU went on strike, JoJo? Because the powers that be at PBUC care about their employees. Not hardly. Just because you don't understand the union mindset and the brotherhood. I should know, because I spent my entire working career dealing with labor/management issues. I have yet to see management ever come to a bargaining table even remotely to bargain in good faith. Nine out of ten times, their original proposals include cuts in benefits and cost of living raises, etc.

So, if a little name calling is too harsh for you I suggest you not read anymore of these quips from posters with strong opinions. You seem to be so easily offended.

If they wanted to replace the striking umpires they should have put this ad in the paper.

PWL,

The union movement's inability and/or unwillingness to communicate with civility and thoughtfulness is why their cause loses more often than it used to. Just look back at your post.

You refuse to acknowledge the simple fact that intelligent and respectful arguments will work far better than the type of talk that you are engaged in.

You have very little chance of persuading undecided umpires and even less chance of changing the minds of some that have already worked in the Minor Leagues this year. One would think that getting support for your cause would be your goal. Clearly, this is not the case.

I hope you enjoy the continuing deterioration of the Union movement in the USA-your method of communication is a large part of why you have less public support as each day goes by.

Joe

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by jwwashburn

You refuse to acknowledge the simple fact that intelligent and respectful arguments will work far better than the type of talk that you are engaged in.

I am very willing to turn the page on this issue and with you personally. I just think that you are absolutely nuts if you think people are going to use language that only fits your personal expectations. This issue is bigger than one word and has emotional elements to it. I have personally talked directly to a few minor league umpires and I have worked other sports with them. The term they use is "scab." One of my parents in a union and has been for years and feels similar to union issues as these umpires do. I know many officials that belong to contractor unions and teacher's union and they feel similar to what these umpires are going through. Sorry if you do not want emotion or certain language into this discussion, it is not going to happen.

Peace

[socalblue1]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Joe:

Who did I insult? Who did a call a name? I thought using professional and ethical conduct as a reason for not crossing a picket line good and logical reasons for my position.

MTD, Sr.

Mark,

It's no use trying to change their mind, because no matter what you say they aren’t going to budge.

This debate began when some inflammatory posts (None by AMLU members to my knowledge) were made in support of the strike. Yes, the umpires crossing the picket line are ‘Scabs’ by most accepted definitions. The content of some of the posts are unsupportable and simply do not in any way track with what AMLU is trying to do (Educate and inform).

I can say that there HAVE been both derogatory and supportive comments made by club staff. While these have not been posted publicly or in news articles, they HAVE been made.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Ump2323

Theres nothing sad about a a union going on strike and having to find replacements. It happens all the time. It wasnt long ago that the MLB umpire went on strike was it sad to see the scab minor league umpires calling the games. I dont think so

Please see my latest post above.

MTD, Sr.