Bad Umpires are Bad Umpires...

Alameda · #1 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 01:55am

Wow. I'm beginning to see some pretty pathetic umpiring in my association. I don't even care if anyone I've invited to this forum from there sees this.

It's bad.

So many bad habits I'm just shrugging off. I'll get into some details later, but alot of it's just basic stuff like mechanics, hustle, enthusasum, etc.

I guess I don't have a Q or anything, I just had to vent.

As you were.

mcrowder · #2 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 09:04am

Are you an umpire in the assoc? A coach? A commish? UIC? What is your role?

Dakota · #3 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 09:23am

From my first year umpiring, I saw this too. People are people, mostly the same in every area of interest. Some are lazy. Some will do enough to get by. Some will invest enough to be competent. Some will be truly crafstmen with pride in their work.

I decided to not let the slackers bother me. They're still there, though. And sometimes I wonder how they get the level of games they do.

AtlUmpSteve · #4 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 09:33am

All the more reason to stay in there. The teams deserve competent umpires; in many cases, their attitude and reactions are a result of the caliber of umpiring they see. You can help bring the overall level up.

SF · #5 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 11:07am

One guy in my association wears his shinguards on the outside of his pants. Another woman calls pitches that bounce on the plate strikes. They refuse to change because they don't care, and they know the need for umpires is great. My association used to have much bigger problems, but about 4 years ago we got a new UIC. He is the one that got me started in umpiring, and has mentored a group of us on how to do things right. Add that to the competent vets, and right now we're building a pretty strong group of umpires. The bad ones are being phased out.

Don't think people can't tell who are the good and bad umpires. We know, my UIC knows, most of the coaches know.

The problem is there are simply too few umpires, and sometimes they have to use less dedicated folks to get all the games done. I'm not saying this is right, just that is how it is.

Do the best you can do - the teams deserve that. Try and find a good partner that you can work with repeatedly and who's commitment is similar to yours. If you have the opportunity to mentor someone, try and help get them on the right path.

bkbjones · #6 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 11:14am

The unfortunate part is that the bad ones bring the rest of us down. We have some tremendous umpires in our region. Unfortunately, we are all tainted and painted by the broad brush of those who are not tremendous. But we are trying.

aevans410 · #7 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 11:17am

Quote:

Originally posted by bkbjones
The unfortunate part is that the bad ones bring the rest of us down. We have some tremendous umpires in our region. Unfortunately, we are all tainted and painted by the broad brush of those who are not tremendous. But we are trying.

I agree there. Maybe this is one of the reasons that we catch so much flack for close plays and close pitches. People are conditioned to bad umpiring that when they get good umpiring, they still ***** and moan.

Alameda · #8 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 11:58am

Quote:

Originally posted by mcrowder
Are you an umpire in the assoc? A coach? A commish? UIC? What is your role?

What me? I'm a rookie Umpire in the Northern California Umpires Association. We work San Francisco and the Penisula.

Quote:

Originally posted by AtlUmpSteve
All the more reason to stay in there. The teams deserve competent umpires; in many cases, their attitude and reactions are a result of the caliber of umpiring they see. You can help bring the overall level up.

Yea, that was part of what made me quinge and come post here. Heard some players, after the game, moanin' about how bad alot of the umpires are. Fortunately I heard them saying I was one of the best they had had (this from the losing team too). That's kinda scarey considering I've been doing this for 2 whole months now lol *rolleyes*

I am, like I said, just shruggin' it off and will stick to my guns and do things the right way.

[Edited by Alameda on May 13th, 2005 at 01:03 PM]

Andy · #9 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 12:01pm

This is a subject that is near and dear to my heart. Actually, seeing bad umpiring just pisses me off....

My daughter has played two years in a rec league sponsored by a local church. The quality of play is not good.

The league co-ordinator uses whoever he can get for umpires. Out of the 7 or 8 guys that he regularly uses, only one shows up in a uniform and when it get hot, he ditches his pants for denim shorts. The rest of the guys just wear whatever. These guys don't know the rules, have no clue on the proper mechanics, and generally appear disinterested.

I have known the league co-ordinator for several years and have offered to do a clinic for the umpires, but he won't take me up on it.

It just irritates the h*ll out of me that I bust my butt to learn and apply the rules and do the job the right way, but people judge all umpires by what these types of clowns do. Is it any wonder that we almost always have an automatic bias against us?

tzme415 · #10 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 12:56pm

I know that I sure dislike seeing bad umpiring. And I know that noone here is talking about someone missing an occasional call. I worked a SP game alone the other night where there was line drive to the gap in left center, so I hustle out to see that the fielder traps the ball. Now I'm half way between 2nd and 3rd, I look at 2nd and the runner from 1st is on the ground just past 2nd. He gets up and makes 3rd. After the play their captain comes to me and asks didn't I see the OBS, it was right in front of you. I had to say that I was watching the ball to see if there was a catch and I missed it. Now I should have maybe had different position and anyone watching might have said I was a bad umpire. The captain did say that he didn't fault me, since I did hustle out to see the catch(trap). He also complemented me on being honest and not just telling him to go sit down. So if even after not seeing a call that would have helped his team, I get complemented - makes me wonder how bad the umpires he's had before must be.

gsf23 · #11 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 01:10pm

Quote:

Originally posted by tzme415
I know that I sure dislike seeing bad umpiring. And I know that noone here is talking about someone missing an occasional call. I worked a SP game alone the other night where there was line drive to the gap in left center, so I hustle out to see that the fielder traps the ball. Now I'm half way between 2nd and 3rd, I look at 2nd and the runner from 1st is on the ground just past 2nd. He gets up and makes 3rd. After the play their captain comes to me and asks didn't I see the OBS, it was right in front of you. I had to say that I was watching the ball to see if there was a catch and I missed it. Now I should have maybe had different position and anyone watching might have said I was a bad umpire. The captain did say that he didn't fault me, since I did hustle out to see the catch(trap). He also complemented me on being honest and not just telling him to go sit down. So if even after not seeing a call that would have helped his team, I get complemented - makes me wonder how bad the umpires he's had before must be.

I am a big believer in being honest with players and managers also. I'm not afraid to tell a guy that I didn't see something or that my angle wasn't the best. Players know when you didn't or couldn't see something and lying to them or telling them to just sit down doesn't make things any better, just leads to more of an argument and less respect.

mcrowder · #12 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 01:42pm

Here's a few solutions.

1) work on truly training your umpires. Have actual clinics (not just the ASA certification "clinic"), weekly meetings, etc. Find things on this board and discuss them. Make up TWP's and discuss them. Whoever shows up should work more games.

2) make sure you're paying enough. My area doesn't - so I can't go recruit anyone from other areas that I see have some talent. I had a great guy lined up to work this year until my commish cut the pay. Then this guy laughed at me and said no-thanks.

3) make sure the UIC cares enough to watch other umpires, and schedule accordingly.

My association has plenty of problems with good umpires. Here are my umpires:

A - me (hopefully a rules-knowledgeable guy)
B - excellent umpire
C - pretty good umpire
D - friendly umpire who is inconsistent and never hustles.
E - 2nd year kid with no motivation other than his pay.
F - 1st year kid that hustles, asks questions, and really wants to learn.

A, B, F, and C get the most time on the field, in that order. D and E only when I'm stuck. Motivate the guys that try by letting them work more.

rwest · #13 (**permalink**) Fri May 13, 2005, 02:49pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Andy
This is a subject that is near and dear to my heart. Actually, seeing bad umpiring just pisses me off....

My daughter has played two years in a rec league sponsored by a local church. The quality of play is not good.

The league co-ordinator uses whoever he can get for umpires. Out of the 7 or 8 guys that he regularly uses, only one shows up in a uniform and when it get hot, he ditches his pants for denim shorts. The rest of the guys just wear whatever. These guys don't know the rules, have no clue on the proper mechanics, and generally appear disinterested.

I have known the league co-ordinator for several years and have offered to do a clinic for the umpires, but he won't take me up on it.

It just irritates the h*ll out of me that I bust my butt to learn and apply the rules and do the job the right way, but people judge all umpires by what these types of clowns do. Is it any wonder that we almost always have an automatic bias against us?

I understand where you are coming from, but let me share with you a different perspective. Having been the Umpire Commissioner for my local church, I have some experience with what the league co-ordinator probably was going through.

First, the umpires were volunteers. They are not getting paid and they are doing it as a service to the Lord and the local church. They are also doing it for the kids.

Second, in most churches 80% of the work is done by 20% of the people. There may have been more qualified individuals in the church, maybe even former or active umpires, but did they volunteer? Probably not. I'm not judging them. They may have valid reasons that they didn't volunteer. That's between them and the Lord. My only point is you get what you get when you are dealing with a volunteer staff.

Third, most churches can't afford to pay for qualified refs.

Fourth, training is great if you can get it but is hardly long enough to do much good. We have training clinics at our church. But they are very limited in content and time. It helps, but you are not going to get the results you would from a national clinic or even a regional clinic that your association may put on. These volunteers aren't for the most part interested in an avocation as an umpire. They just want to help out and most churches are desparate enough to tak anyone that has a pulse.

If more people in the church volunteered, instead of the 20%, then you'd probably have better umpires.

Sorry for preaching, but that's one of my pet peeves.

tcannizzo · #14 (**permalink**) Sat May 14, 2005, 08:03am

One rook to another. Some of this might be first season dues. Chances are your booking agent isn't putting you in the highest quality of ball. Therefore, many of your partners may not be the brightest bulbs on the tree, even thought they may have been around for a few years.

You gotta be careful who you watch, and who you listen to.

I don't allow the level of my partner's umpiring affect the quality of the game that I give. And I laugh my *** off when they try to point out a mistake on my part.

Stat-Man · #15 (**permalink**) Sat May 14, 2005, 12:44pm

Quote:

Originally posted by tzme415
I know that I sure dislike seeing bad umpiring. And I know that noone here is talking about someone missing an occasional call. I worked a SP game alone the other night where there was line drive to the gap in left center, so I hustle out to see that the fielder traps the ball. Now I'm half way between 2nd and 3rd, I look at 2nd and the runner from 1st is on the ground just past 2nd. He gets up and makes 3rd. After the play their captain comes to me and asks didn't I see the OBS, it was right in front of you. I had to say that I was watching the ball to see if there was a catch and I missed it. Now I should have maybe had different position and anyone watching might have said I was a bad umpire. The captain did say that he didn't fault me, since I did hustle out to see the catch(trap). He also complemented me on being honest and not just telling him to go sit down. So if even after not seeing a call that would have helped his team, I get complemented - makes me wonder how bad the umpires he's had before must be.

I can't speak for everyone, but coaches do appreciate hustle, especially when a blue is working solo.

In our area, we occasioanlly have one one umpire show up for our JV games. Sometimes the umpire stays behind home the entire game and calls everythign from there. Other times, we have a blue who will hustle out and try hard to have a good angle for plays out on the field.

At one JV game with one umpire, the umpire came up to our coach after the end of the inning to comment that he tried to get a good angle on a bang-bang play and might have missed something. Instead of arguing or being upset, coach praised him for hustling and at least trying to get a good angle.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that even if it's not obvious or actively recognized, coaches do appreciate umpires who hustle and strive for consistency, even if it gets lost in all the arguing