Captains meeting

[Rich]

To me, it's amazing how some people can get so worked up over what, to me, is window dressing (Rich vs. Mr. MyLastName) and yet don't think a 12-year old saying "You suck" to an official (see the other thread) warrants a flagrant technical foul.

I'd rather be called Rich and have genuine respect shown me than be called Mr. Anything and not have genuine respect for me or my position. Keep the window dressing. Call me anything you like as long as you treat me appropriately when something doesn't go your way.

And to me, that's one of the things wrong today -- too few coaches willing to tell a player, "That behavior is unacceptable, you're done for the day" when a kid gets whacked for behavior. Instead, the coach wants to argue the technical foul and tell the kid (out of earshot) that he did nothing wrong. Of course, that's where the kids get this behavior from -- either the coach models this behavior or doesn't step on it when his players exhibit those behaviors.

[VaTerp]

I don't think anyone is really worked up over this.

As you said, it's window dressing. In the grand scheme of things it really doesn't matter because kids should not, and in my case have NEVER, addressed me by my first OR last name during a game.

It's a personal preference for a captain's meeting intro that last no more than 30 seconds.

But Rich, you're the one who sort of made it an issue by saying you get a kick out of other officials who prefer to introduce themselves as "Mr." and then you step in using your first name as if it somehow makes you more approachable or less stuffy or whatever it is you think it does.

Again, to me it does not matter as no player is addressing by either. Sometimes I use my first name, but increasingly I just shake hands and do a generic greeting without my name.

As a former teacher and director of youth camps and rec programs, I do see where Rut is coming from though. Kids are absolutely more disrespectful today than they were when I was in high school in the mid 90s, and I'm sure we were more disrespectful then kids growing up in years prior. And a big reason for that is parents and adults who are more concerned about being liked and being their friends than they are about being a parent/adult and setting proper boundaries.

I don't think using your first name at a captain's meeting is part of that problem but I also see absolutely nothing wrong with adults who introduce themselves to teenagers with a "Mr. or Mrs." in any setting, including a captain's meeting.

[mj]

Never say never. Earlier this year during a dead ball substitute wait, I told a captain who was inbounding "I like the way you play Megan, you play hard all the time." Her response, "Thank you.........thank you Mark"

First time ever and it made my night on an otherwise crappy night.

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by mj

Never say never. Earlier this year during a dead ball substitute wait, I told a captain who was inbounding "I like the way you play Megan, you play hard all the time." Her response, "Thank you.........thank you Mark"

First time ever and it made my night on an otherwise crappy night.

Thank you for contributing to the downfall of America's youth. smh...

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by mj

Never say never. Earlier this year during a dead ball substitute wait, I told a captain who was inbounding "I like the way you play Megan, you play hard all the time." Her response, "Thank you.........thank you Mark"

First time ever and it made my night on an otherwise crappy night.

I always address players by their number, even when I have known them from coaching AAU, or other circles.

Cool exchange though. The problem would be when you get the smart azz kid who uses your name in a disrespectful manner. To this point I've never seen it happen in a scholastic game but have during high school rec leagues.

My experience with those leagues has not been great as I have run into a lot of spoiled, entitled, little punks who think they can say and do whatever they want. I would never give those kids my first name and during those capt's meetings simply say we are your officials today.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by VaTerp

But Rich, you're the one who sort of made it an issue by saying you get a kick out of other officials who prefer to introduce themselves as "Mr." and then you step in using your first name as if it somehow makes you more approachable or less stuffy or whatever it is you think it does.

I love Rich, but this I totally agree with you on this one. Rich started the "I am Rich" thing.

For the record I will say again, I always say my full name to captains and coaches. They are not allowed to call me by my first name in this setting.

Peace

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I love Rich, but this I totally agree with you on this one. Rich started the "I am Rich" thing.

For the record I will say again, I always say my full name to captains and coaches. They are not allowed to call me by my first name in this setting.

Peace

I have done just first name to captains in some cases to be consistent with my partners. To me it does sound a little off to have some officials use their first name and some "Mr. or Mrs."

I think I will go the full name route from now on as I do with coaches. The other week I did a Montrose Christian game where their star player introduced himself by his full name, "Justin Anderson." First time I think I've heard a player do so.

I kinda laughed and thought to myself, "I know your name, you stiffed my alma mater by decommitting and signing with UVA."

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I love Rich, but this I totally agree with you on this one. Rich started the "I am Rich" thing.

For the record I will say again, I always say my full name to captains and coaches. They are not allowed to call me by my first name in this setting.

Peace

And what would you do if they did?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

And what would you do if they did?

Tell them they are not allowed to call me by my first name. It is pretty simple.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Tell them they are not allowed to call me by my first name. It is pretty simple.

Peace

Hello, Mr. Unapproachable.

[Raymond]

As opposed to Mr. Closed-minded.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Hello, Mr. Unapproachable.

I do not want to be approached by players, that is what their coach is for. And I hardly have a problem talking to coaches. But considering the things I read you say about situations, I certainly cannot be seen as any more unapproachable than you are (and I do not mean that in a bad way before someone takes it that way). You put up with a lot less crap than I do.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by VaTerp

...
But Rich, you're the one who sort of made it an issue by saying you get a kick out of other officials who prefer to introduce themselves as "Mr." and then you step in using your first name as if it somehow makes you more approachable or less stuffy or whatever it is you think it does.

...

Exactly. He was the first one to make a big deal about it. Basically saying (and has for years in when this subject has come up) that anybody who doesn't introduce themselves to the kids by their first name is an a$$-hole.

Originally Posted by VaTerp

...I think I will go the full name route from now on as I do with coaches. The other week I did a Montrose Christian game where their star player introduced himself by his full name, "Justin Anderson." First time I think I've heard a player do so.

I kinda laughed and thought to myself, "I know your name, you stiffed my alma mater by decommitting and signing with UVA..."

I've officiated many of his AAU games. One of the nicest kids I've ever encountered in officiating.

[26 Year Gap]

"Hello, I am Ref, and this is Ump1 & Ump2."

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

To me, it's amazing how some people can get so worked up over what, to me, is window dressing (Rich vs. Mr. MyLastName) and yet don't think a 12-year old saying "You suck" to an official (see the other thread) warrants a flagrant technical foul.

I'd rather be called Rich and have genuine respect shown me than be called Mr. Anything and not have genuine respect for me or my position. Keep the window dressing. Call me anything you like as long as you treat me appropriately when something doesn't go your way.

And to me, that's one of the things wrong today -- too few coaches willing to tell a player, "That behavior is unacceptable, you're done for the day" when a kid gets whacked for behavior. Instead, the coach wants to argue the technical foul and tell the kid (out of earshot) that he did nothing wrong. Of course, that's where the kids get this behavior from -- either the coach models this behavior or doesn't step on it when his players exhibit those behaviors.

I agree with this whole post....

As for the bolded part, it is refreshing to see when a coach does put his foot down when a player gets silly. I whacked a JVB player in a tournament a few weeks ago for popping off, and his coach yanked him for a few minutes. He didn't sit him for the rest of the game, but he made it known he wasn't pleased with him. He didn't question me about it or anything.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I love Rich, but this I totally agree with you on this one. Rich started the "I am Rich" thing.

For the record I will say again, I always say my full name to captains and coaches. They are not allowed to call me by my first name in this setting.

Peace

You don't let coaches call you by your first name during the game? What do you do if they call you by that? Ask them to stop?

In college baseball (And professional for that matter), umpires and coaches/managers use first names. I work college games, so it kind of carries over to basketball for me.