Camps this Offseason

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Let me add this last part. I work college football at the Division 3 level and have worked it for almost 8 years or so when they changed the system or the assigning process. I work for the B1G Alliance where they used D3 so that they can get all their officials for that work the MAC, Missouri Valley and even the B1G. All the newer D1 officials come from the D3 ranks for the most part within this Alliance. You know how they pick those officials to even be considered for D3? Who you know. Who you are related to. Who likes you and gives you a recommendation. There are not on-field independent camps where you can work to get some experience or be trained. There is a big training meeting before the season that we do not pay for if you are on a crew or you are on the supplemental list, but it is one day and absolutely no on field evaluation whatsoever. So people get invited to that meeting and hardly have a high school varsity schedule in many situations from my area.

Then I used to work D1 baseball for a brief period of time. I got that opportunity only because I had worked with a minor league umpire (at the time) during the basketball season at a high school basketball game in the middle of December. We had a great game together and got along very well. I had a conversation with this person and talked about how I was a baseball umpire and had some baseball experience at the college level. Well, the conversation went so well, Minor League Umpires went on strike later that fall and he passed my name along to the assignor and I got a call on Saturday of Easter Weekend to go to Valparaiso to finish working a two games of that series at the D1 level on Easter Sunday. I was not going to work the plate and I never had to show up to any camp to get that opportunity. That officials is now an MLB full-time umpire and it was by his word alone I even got considered. I worked for about 2 or 3 years in that conference and mostly worked D2 baseball, but never had to prove it beyond working a real game.

I say all of this because that is what happens without camps at all. Then if you have the right last name or your dad/uncle is in the NFL, then someone gives you a shot that you did not earn by talent or training alone. Certainly not anything a supervisor was exposed to. That is why I ask, "What is the solution?"

Peace

So you're implying that there isn't any nepotism/politics in basketball? Milk through the nose.

There are multiple 20-somethings in the southeast who are in D1 because of their last names.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by SC Official

So you're implying that there isn't any nepotism/politics in basketball? Milk through the nose.

There are multiple 20-somethings in the southeast who are in D1 because of their last names.

That is actually not what I said. I said that there is even more when you have nothing else to go on but your name and the powers that be picking people based on nothing but what they are told about a prospect. If you get rid of the camp system or how it is now, you might be more like sports that do not do camps as a way to evaluate new talent. Of course that could work on some level to get rid of the things you do not like, but it creates other bigger issues that officials like to complain about. At least in the current system I am making some kind of choice.

There obviously is some nepotism in basketball. But there are so many spots that there are folks that can overcome some of this in basketball. If I cannot even get access to the people that assign the football conferences by no well-used process, then you have more people getting into place without any proving of their ability.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by SC Official

So you're implying that there isn't any nepotism/politics in basketball? Milk through the nose.



There are multiple 20-somethings in the southeast who are in D1 because of their last names.

The advantages of having family members proceed you in this avocation in the Mid-Atlantic is not a secret and openly acknowledged by the main power broker.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[Player989random]

I work college soccer, and I agree with Rutledge on what happens if you don't have camps. Now, soccer is starting to transition to camps because soccer can't find enough refs, but at these camps we get paid to work. The thing is soccer pays so well, if you tried to get people to try out for anything other than MLS or the minor professional leagues without any payment, people wouldn't go. We still have siblings and family members who get the call for games they aren't ready for, but I've learned to accept that that is going to happen from sports to business to politics to whatever.

The nepotism: As a guy in my mid-20s, the only thing that irks me is when I meet a guy my age who doesn't realize he is in the G-League or on a D1 staff is because of "Daddy". A guy who's been reffing for 3 years is in the D2 National Tournament? What's his last name? Oh yeah, of course. But when that guy has the gall to start talking to me about "Staying hungry" and "Trusting the system"? Take a long walk on a short pier, buddy. You've no idea what you're talking about.

But I agree with Rutledge's overall question: What's the solution? I hate camps, but what do we switch to? Game-film? I got a buddy who paid $525 to have a D1 Women's supervisor rate his film. Would I do that? Maybe, I don't know.

[JRutledge]

I do think that children of this or relatives can sometimes know things that others do not early in their careers. If you are around something a good portion of your life you can pick up on things that someone not in that are not exposed would know. I can speak for personal experience on this just having a Ph.D. as a parent. Your parents or relatives can give you little nuggets it might take you years to learn on your own. That being all said, I do not like it when you see multiple cases of guys at the top level are there and the only thing that really distinguishes them is their association or name. That is why I am skeptical of when people say they do not like the camp system because I have seen it for years without any camps in other sports. At least with the camp system, I can make a lot of personal choices about what I want to do. Without camps, I have to contact people and hope my name is passed along or recommended. I have gone to camps and gotten hired because I showed what I can do. And there is still a system in place that benefits the children, relatives and very good friends, but at least I can show my worth next to them on some level.

Peace

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Player989random

The nepotism: As a guy in my mid-20s, the only thing that irks me is when I meet a guy my age who doesn't realize he is in the G-League or on a D1 staff is because of "Daddy". A guy who's been reffing for 3 years is in the D2 National Tournament? What's his last name? Oh yeah, of course. But when that guy has the gall to start talking to me about "Staying hungry" and "Trusting the system"? Take a long walk on a short pier, buddy. You've no idea what you're talking about.

This is the main thing that drives me nuts - the political correctness (for lack of a better term) from the lucky few who have made it to the highest level and want to preach to the commoners. There are many officials who never make it to the highest level and should be there instead of some of the other guys if you just go by ability. And when you point out the politics or the camp racket people say "well, you must not care about getting better." It's as though it's taboo to talk about the flaws.