Reaching out of your area

[ilyazhito]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Good luck to you. Something about a horse and water...let me know where you are in say 10 years. I should be more patient...however, you lose me when you say there are no 50/50 calls...You need to learn that there are and not split hairs.... If you are In my crew one of first things I’m going to tell you...be aware of what we call. If I call a charge at one end and you have similar play....(0/50 or even 55-45.) call it same. I don’t expect you take bullet for me if I completely butcher it. Get it right.”
You saying there’s no 50/50 calls shows your lack of experience..You won’t move up nor should you with this view. Lot of things are black and white.Those are the easy things. Can you SEE and referee the GRAY areas...

I only said that there are no 50/50 B/C calls in NCAA because of the restricted area. This means that defender in restricted area with illegal contact (and no unnatural position /motion by offensive player) = block, defender outside with illegal contact = charge if defender is legal, otherwise block. I did not say that there are no 50/50 calls in general, just for a specific situation.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

I only said that there are no 50/50 B/C calls in NCAA because of the restricted area. This means that defender in restricted area with illegal contact (and no unnatural position /motion by offensive player) = block, defender outside with illegal contact = charge if defender is legal, otherwise block. I did not say that there are no 50/50 calls in general, just for a specific situation.

Hmmmm:

In NCAA, no block charge play is 50/50, because of the restricted area arc...

So there are no 50/50 block/charge calls outside of the restricted area? And I guess you've never picked up a play late. You ALWAYS know if the defender was legal b/c you see everything all the time?

How many NCAA games have you worked that you are able to tell us what does or doesn't occur in an NCAA game?

[ilyazhito]

Raymond, re-read post #70. I may not always know what is happening, but I can pickup my secondary defenders and identify their actions and legal/illegal position. I make B/C decisions based on their location (irrelevant for NFHS) and legality. This is why block/charge plays are simple for me (not necessarily easy, because there are moving bodies at high speeds).

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

Raymond, re-read post #70. I may not always know what is happening, but I can pickup my secondary defenders and identify their actions and legal/illegal position. I make B/C decisions based on their location (irrelevant for NFHS) and legality. This is why block/charge plays are simple for me (not necessarily easy, because there are moving bodies at high speeds).

Again, you have a limited amount of experience. There are going to be times where you pick up plays late or are looking in the wrong place then all of a sudden there is a crash in your primary. You live in a Black & White world. Officiating has a lot of grey areas and unexpected things that happen. Believe it or not, most officials judge their B/C calls on the legality of the defenders, you're not opening up some new world to the rest of us. You need to listen more and curtail some of the lectures and history lessons you dispense to us.

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by Raymond

Again, you have a limited amount of experience. There are going to be times where you pick up plays late or are looking in the wrong place then all of a sudden there is a crash in your primary. You live in a Black & White world. Officiating has a lot of grey areas and unexpected things that happen. Believe it or not, most officials judge their B/C calls on the legality of the defenders, you're not opening up some new world to the rest of us. You need to listen more and curtail some of the lectures and history lessons you dispense to us.

Stay in your lane bro!

(not directed at you Raymond, just quoting my new favorite commercial and telling ilyazhito to listen more, talk less)

[Rich]

I am merely a HS official. I have a certain mentality when I work a game.

I own my primary and realize I can't go reaching out of it in an effort to save the world. If I do that, I might get a call right, but I'm losing ownership of my primary. And I'm just as likely to get a call wrong.

Frankly, this is easiest to do when I don't know the other officials well. We work a lot of games in crews and when I work with my regular guys, we are really comfortable grabbing something we think a partner missed and the lines on the floor get, unfortunately, blurred.

But when I'm with relative strangers, I think to myself -- I want them to think of me as a good partner. And I only reach when I know I have to and have an open look at what I'm reaching for. Stay in my damned primary.

There are times when all eyes have to be on the ball. Last possession, player takes it to the rack or elevates for a winning jump shot. There's nothing else that matters there. If there's contact from the backside or something the primary official CAN'T see, then we have to come and get it. Otherwise? It's just one call in a 36 minute game and I'm not injecting a whole bunch of nonsense into a game just so we MAYBE get the call right on the floor.

A lot of these "reaching" scenarios involve one official (not primary) substituting his judgment for another's (primary). That's just wrong, completely wrong.

[JRutledge]

Bottom line, I want to beat the tape. That is it. I do not care about much else. And unless you are working a TV game with multiple angles, it is harder to beat the tape. I called a play kind of out of my area on Saturday, it was the only call out of my area they entire game. It did not save the game. It just was an open look and gave my partners every opportunity to see it. But I was not doing that again. The call did not save the world or the game. And if I passed on the play, no one would have said anything but maybe the shooter (he is on the video saying he got hit on the arm).

I just think there are plays we are going to miss and I am not putting my bread and butter on calls outside of my primary when I respect the partners I am working with.

Peace