Trick play, middle school. Your take...

[SamG]

Originally Posted by footballref

But because is it on the news and they say it is legal, then it HAS to be legal

Since the refs didn't flag it, why would news stations, websites, etc think the play is illegal? If I didn't hang out on this board, I wouldn't have known. Blame your brothers in stripes, NOT those showing the video.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by SamG

Since the refs didn't flag it, why would news stations, websites, etc think the play is illegal? If I didn't hang out on this board, I wouldn't have known. Blame your brothers in stripes, NOT those showing the video.

The issue isn't so much the NBC, CBS, and ABCs screwing it up (although they are supposed to be reporters too), it's ESPN screwing it up. ESPN is supposed to have a bunch of football journalists on staff. A journalist who is doing his job right would know enough about football to at the very least think "something's not right about this" and then call one of the 10 or so football referees his developed a relationship with to do a little research. A real journalist would already know the rule cold and wouldn't need the research.

It's just another sorry statement on the poor quality of sports journalism. All they require of them is the ability to look at a screen and go "Wow! Look at that!"

Edit: This of course doesn't excuse the referee crew for kicking it.

[SamG]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

The issue isn't so much the NBC, CBS, and ABCs screwing it up (although they are supposed to be reporters too), it's ESPN screwing it up. ESPN is supposed to have a bunch of football journalists on staff. A journalist who is doing his job right would know enough about football to at the very least think "something's not right about this" and then call one of the 10 or so football referees his developed a relationship with to do a little research. A real journalist would already know the rule cold and wouldn't need the research.

It's just another sorry statement on the poor quality of sports journalism. All they require of them is the ability to look at a screen and go "Wow! Look at that!"

Edit: This of course doesn't excuse the referee crew for kicking it.

I disagree that a sports journalist is expected to know all the rules, even in a sport as popular as football. Even if a commentator saw the clip and thought "something's not right", the fact no one on the field (who should be up to date on ALL rules) threw a flag would probably be enough for him to think "it must be legal".

Let's even use someone who played/coached football, and presumably knows the rules better than your "average" sports journalist. They see the play and know it was illegal when/where they played, but they don't know what rule set is being used or even if a rule might have changed since they played. They see no yellow flags following the play so "it must be legal".

Believe me, I get that commentators are clueless and often give our wrong information (particularly when you're talking about details about an issue). But without a) yellow flags on the field or b) a coach or someone protesting the illegality of the play, I don't see anything to "raise flags" (pun intended) in anyone's mind.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by SamG

I disagree that a sports journalist is expected to know all the rules, even in a sport as popular as football. Even if a commentator saw the clip and thought "something's not right", the fact no one on the field (who should be up to date on ALL rules) threw a flag would probably be enough for him to think "it must be legal".

Let's even use someone who played/coached football, and presumably knows the rules better than your "average" sports journalist. They see the play and know it was illegal when/where they played, but they don't know what rule set is being used or even if a rule might have changed since they played. They see no yellow flags following the play so "it must be legal".

Believe me, I get that commentators are clueless and often give our wrong information (particularly when you're talking about details about an issue). But without a) yellow flags on the field or b) a coach or someone protesting the illegality of the play, I don't see anything to "raise flags" (pun intended) in anyone's mind.

This kind of lack of expectation is why they get away with it. Journalists are lazy because we don't demand any better from them. If your livelihood depends on writing stories about a game, the least you should do is learn the rules of the game. After all, it's really not a hard thing to do.

But for some reason, we just accept that they're lazy.

[bisonlj]

Don't forget announcers and writers do not hesitate to say officials got a play wrong in other instances where they don't throw flags. They rarely assume that just because a flag isn't thrown it must be legal.

I would never expect a journalist to know the rule on a goofy play like this. There should be some kind of trigger in their head though to check with someone who does know. Unfortunately he could have called his buddy who was the R in the game and still gotten the wrong information.

[SamG]

Originally Posted by bisonlj

Don't forget announcers and writers do not hesitate to say officials got a play wrong in other instances where they don't throw flags. They rarely assume that just because a flag isn't thrown it must be legal.

I would never expect a journalist to know the rule on a goofy play like this.

I'm sorry, I should have specified. You are correct about announcers calling out officials when there's no flag, but I think it's safe to say that's for more "well known" (I use that term loosely) rules.

There should be some kind of trigger in their head though to check with someone who does know. Unfortunately he could have called his buddy who was the R in the game and still gotten the wrong information.

I think this is one of those where even if someone thought "it looked wrong", the "crowd's" reaction convinced him HE was wrong. Does that make sense?

[JasonTX]

Under Fed rules, what position is the player receiving the snap in? Lineman, back, or neither? By NCAA rules: One player may be between his scrimmage line and the backs if in a position to receive a hand-to-hand snap from between the snapper’s legs. When in such position, that player may receive the snap himself or it may go directly to any player legally a back [S19].

The problem with this play for NCAA is that the ball did not go between the snappers legs.

[Texas Aggie]

So, I'd like TA to explain exactly how you have a quick and continuous motion and the ball leaving the hand in that motion unless it fairly immediately leaves the hand.

And I'd like you to show how what I said was incorrect. The NFHS rules doesn't say "fairly immediately," and the NCAA rules doesn't use either term.

There are legal snaps where the ball does not leave the hand until the arm is well underway with its motion in a front to back (or at an angle) way. I would NOT call that immediate.

[BuckeyeRef]

Originally Posted by SamG

Since the refs didn't flag it, why would news stations, websites, etc think the play is illegal? If I didn't hang out on this board, I wouldn't have known. Blame your brothers in stripes, NOT those showing the video.

I know that is what I have told at least two dozen people since this play was seen. I tell them all it was illegal and should have been blown dead. I have told two junior high coaches and both of them said they had thought about trying to run this play next year. Every year one crew lets a play like this stand and all of us have to break the bad news to the 100 copycats.