Free throw administration

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by Fritz

Since we are on the topic of free throw administration, had this happen Mon night. 8th grade boys game. A1 at the line to shoot the first of two shots (foul on B1 while in the act of shooting, unsuccessful). After A1 releases the shot, B2 clearly steps into the lane before the shot reaches the vicinity of the basket. I say "vicinity" because the shot doesn't draw iron.

I'm lead and give the lane violation sign, then trail (2-man crew of course) blows the whistle on the no-rim. We consulted and my partner thought that because B1 violated first, we should re-shoot the shot. I thought that since it was a double violation, we wipe off that shot and just shoot the 2nd one.

Who is right? By the way, since my partner was the senior official, we went with his call and sold the coaches that way with no arguments.

You're right. It's actually a simultaneous violation though, not double. You just shoot the second shot. If this happens on the second free throw, you do an AP throw-in on the end line.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by zm1283

You're right. It's actually a simultaneous violation though, not double. You just shoot the second shot. If this happens on the second free throw, you do an AP throw-in on the end line.

Unless there was disconcertion (doesn't sound like it from the OP, though).

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Unless there was disconcertion (doesn't sound like it from the OP, though).

You're right. I didn't mention that.

I did think of this though: If Team B violates and Team A shoots a no-rimmer on the first of two shots, is it a simultaneous violation? B does violate, but is it even a violation on A since it's the first of two free throws? Wouldn't you call a violation on B and re-shoot the first free throw?

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by zm1283

I did think of this though: If Team B violates and Team A shoots a no-rimmer on the first of two shots, is it a simultaneous violation? B does violate, but is it even a violation on A since it's the first of two free throws? Wouldn't you call a violation on B and re-shoot the first free throw?

You're not the first one to have that thought. This kind of stuff already appears in the NFHS Case Book. I strongly suggest that you get ahold of a copy and read it cover-to-cover.


9.1.3 SITUATION H:

While A1 is attempting a final free throw, (a) B1 enters the lane too soon followed by A2, both of whom are in marked lane spaces; or (b) B1, in a marked lane space enters the lane too soon, then shooter A1 steps on the free-throw line while releasing the throw. RULING: In (a), the violation by A2 is ignored and, if the try is successful, the goal shall count and the violation by B1, shall be ignored. If the try is unsuccessful, the ball shall become dead when the free throw ends and a substitute free throw shall be attempted by A1 under the same conditions as those for the original free throw. In (b), a double violation is called and the ball is put in play using the alternating-possession procedure. COMMENT: Anytime the defense violates first, followed by a violation by the freethrow shooter, the officials should consider the possibility of disconcertion. (9-1 Penalty)

9.1.3 SITUATION G:

As A1 starts the free-throwing motion, B1 hurriedly raises his/her arms. In the judgment of the official, the action of B1 disconcerts A1 and causes the attempt to miss the basket ring. RULING: As soon as the ball misses the ring, it becomes dead. Since free thrower A1 violated following disconcertion, a substitute free throw is awarded. (9-1-3a Penalty 4c)

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

You're not the first one to have that thought. This kind of stuff already appears in the NFHS Case Book. I strongly suggest that you get ahold of a copy and read it cover-to-cover.


9.1.3 SITUATION H:

While A1 is attempting a final free throw, (a) B1 enters the lane too soon followed by A2, both of whom are in marked lane spaces; or (b) B1, in a marked lane space enters the lane too soon, then shooter A1 steps on the free-throw line while releasing the throw. RULING: In (a), the violation by A2 is ignored and, if the try is successful, the goal shall count and the violation by B1, shall be ignored. If the try is unsuccessful, the ball shall become dead when the free throw ends and a substitute free throw shall be attempted by A1 under the same conditions as those for the original free throw. In (b), a double violation is called and the ball is put in play using the alternating-possession procedure. COMMENT: Anytime the defense violates first, followed by a violation by the freethrow shooter, the officials should consider the possibility of disconcertion. (9-1 Penalty)

9.1.3 SITUATION G:

As A1 starts the free-throwing motion, B1 hurriedly raises his/her arms. In the judgment of the official, the action of B1 disconcerts A1 and causes the attempt to miss the basket ring. RULING: As soon as the ball misses the ring, it becomes dead. Since free thrower A1 violated following disconcertion, a substitute free throw is awarded. (9-1-3a Penalty 4c)

What are you implying that I don't know or am missing? We've already covered the cases that you posted. I have a case book and I know that rule.

I was asking about the first of two free throws, not the final free throw, which is what your first situation is referring to.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by zm1283

What are you implying that I don't know or am missing? We've already covered the cases that you posted. I have a case book and I know that rule.

I was asking about the first of two free throws, not the final free throw, which is what your first situation is referring to.

I've forgotten the OP, but if there's a single violation by the defense on the first FT, throw it again. If there are two violations enforced, then wipe tout the first FT, and go to the second.

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I've forgotten the OP, but if there's a single violation by the defense on the first FT, throw it again. If there are two violations enforced, then wipe tout the first FT, and go to the second.

I know this already. I'm not trying to be rude, but I know that a single violation by the defense on a FT results in re-shooting if it's missed. The OP was about a simultaneous violation occuring.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by zm1283

What are you implying that I don't know or am missing? We've already covered the cases that you posted. I have a case book and I know that rule.

I was asking about the first of two free throws, not the final free throw, which is what your first situation is referring to.

It doesn't matter which free throw you're shooting, enforcement is the same. If each team violates, wipe away the shot and take it away. If only the defense violates, reshoot if the shooter misses.

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

It doesn't matter which free throw you're shooting, enforcement is the same. If each team violates, wipe away the shot and take it away. If only the defense violates, reshoot if the shooter misses.

I realize that, but if it's the first free throw where a simultaneous violation occurs you don't go to the arrow. That's the point I was getting at.

I know the bolded part. I hope that anyone who officiates or watches this game would know that.