Runner assisted by coach

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by snorman75

No, never said make I screwed up call because it does not matter. If anything the opposite. Team up 20+ runs and still stealing, any close play is going to be a out, it might not even be that close.

While I agree that this is a pain in the butt to deal with, it's what we're paid to do. Why are you in such a hurry to get home?

Originally Posted by snorman75

You do not change your strike zone when it is a blow out. If you say you do not adjust to the game situation, well I do not think you are being truthful with yourself.

My strike zone hasn't changed in 16 years (unless it was mat ball). Period. I have more integrity than that.

Originally Posted by snorman75

In this situation, well my heart was never behind not calling her out every time. Truthfully, I would had called her out in the first inning, and welcomed a protest to put it to bed finally.

P.S. We have put it to bed in our Board, it is a out.

I don't know who your board is, but it does not appear to be the consensus of ASA (yet). The current mandates are "get it right" and "call it by the book." If what you call is not in the book, then you're calling it wrong.

Originally Posted by snorman75

P.S.S I am talking playing more to the situation in kids and lower level teen games. Adults and U16 and up there really is not much gray area.

I won't even touch this one.

[snorman75]

Sorry Dave,
We just disagree with ASA rules with a HR. Since it is not clear, until we hear something we are going to disagree.

The other stuff, well if you do not adjust, again we agree to disagree.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by snorman75

You have never called a runner out, knowing they are safe?

No, and probably never will. My brain and integrity will not permit it.

I have, and will.

Damn shame.

What grounds does the losing team have to protest? They going to protest they lost by 3 not 2?

But they might be able to do it. The only thing that might stop them from legally protesting is that the game can not be picked up at the point of the protest since the winning run is good. So making any protest adding runs to a won game moot.

Maybe they'll protest just to get the UIC's attention.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by snorman75

You have never called a runner out, knowing they are safe? I have, and will.

I've blown calls, but certainly never on purpose.

Youre an official OF the game. Its not your game bro.

Remember this always, first and foremost:

"The integrity of the game".

You need to fix your thought process on this, it really is bad.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by snorman75

No, never said make I screwed up call because it does not matter. If anything the opposite. Team up 20+ runs and still stealing, any close play is going to be a out, it might not even be that close.

It shouldn't be. It should be whatever it was, safe or out. The game score or situation makes no difference.

Originally Posted by snorman75

You do not change your strike zone when it is a blow out. If you say you do not adjust to the game situation, well I do not think you are being truthful with yourself.

The game situation makes no difference to me. I had a varsity game this past season where the final was 27-3. Neither me nor my partner changed a thing about what we were doing. This is what is called professionalism.

Originally Posted by snorman75

You have never called a runner out, knowing they are safe? I have, and will.

I am embarrassed for you! Of course I, and hopefully anyone else involved with umpiring, have never knowingly made the wrong call. That is absurd. A travesty. If you really do these things, then may I implore you to give up umpiring. Go get a part time job at Wal-Mart since it seems to be about the money for you, as no self respecting umpire who works the game for the fun and enjoyment of it would ever dream of doing the things you profess.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by snorman75

The other stuff, well if you do not adjust, again we agree to disagree.

The only adjusting that needs to be done is your approach to umpiring the game. Period. You are there to umpire, not to make the game the easier on yourself.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by snorman75

Sorry Dave,
We just disagree with ASA rules with a HR. Since it is not clear, until we hear something we are going to disagree.

I think ASA is as clear as they need to be on this. The ball has already touched the ground (or some other object) in dead ball territory. The ball is dead. At this time, the runner assistance rule only pertains to a live ball situation.

Originally Posted by snorman75

The other stuff, well if you do not adjust, again we agree to disagree.

I may adjust my positioning behind F4. I may adjust my set position on a shorter batter. I may even adjust my cup between innings.

I do not adjust my calls just because I want to get a game over faster. Why should I be in such a hurry?

[kcg NC2Ablu]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

I think ASA is as clear as they need to be on this. The ball has already touched the ground (or some other object) in dead ball territory. The ball is dead. At this time, the runner assistance rule only pertains to a live ball situation.



I may adjust my positioning behind F4. I may adjust my set position on a shorter batter. I may even adjust my cup between innings.

I do not adjust my calls just because I want to get a game over faster. Why should I be in such a hurry?

Maybe you shouldnt be ... after all it could always be a rain delay ... with the saying ... "and Four and a half hours later"

[CecilOne]

It's great to see so many speaking out about not changing because of game situations. I hate that idea and although I sometimes joke about rainy 7th innings and games over the time limit , I hope no one thinks I mean it.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

It's great to see so many speaking out about not changing because of game situations. I hate that idea and although I sometimes joke about rainy 7th innings and games over the time limit , I hope no one thinks I mean it.

Sadly, though, apparently some folks really DO mean it. That still just blows me away.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

Sadly, though, apparently some folks really DO mean it. That still just blows me away.

Joking about such things is common among just about any umpire group at any tournament. I never even considered any of it to be serious talk, just good natured ribbing of the poor slob who had the 4 tie-breaker 20 minute innings in a 10U game!

Unless, of course, you're talking about time-shaving in Seattle!

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Joking about such things is common among just about any umpire group at any tournament.

But we have to be careful. I once got in trouble for making that kind of joke with my partner which was overheard by a spectator who told a coach.

[snorman75]

Guys,

First ASA is not clear on the home run. The home run effect is the ONLY effect of a ball going out of play the does not state in the first sentence, "The ball is dead." Omission by mistake or on purpose, ??? and they have not said.

You are telling me none of you have ever sent a message with a call? I have, and I will, part of game management in my eyes.

Example:

Little league, team winning by 20+ runs, still stealing on every pass ball and taking every close pitch.

1. My strike zone grows, if they can hit it it is probably going to be a strike.
2. Anything close is a out, for the team up.
3. If they keep running, they miss a base or leave early, either way I call a one or two out. Normally the message is heard and they stop running.

Are you protecting the integrity of the game making the losing team stand in the field for 45 min? and get beat for 50?

Well I am sorry I feel that hurts the game and the kids much worst and I am willing to take a hit to my integrity for that. We all know we have coaches out there that will run the score up on there own mother. It has really nothing to do with time of the game or wanting to get home.

[snorman75]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

But we have to be careful. I once got in trouble for making that kind of joke with my partner which was overheard by a spectator who told a coach.

Got you beat, ran a league, the two umps got together and said in front of the captains, well we only have 3 min left in the time, so lets not start another inning, and then got in their cars and left. It was the easiest/ quickest protest I ever dealt with.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by snorman75

...You are telling me none of you have ever sent a message with a call? I have, and I will, part of game management in my eyes....

No, I have not. I don't make up outs to "punish" a coach who I think deserves it. I will adjust the strike zone to the level of play, but not to send a message, and it is the same zone for both sides (to the best of my ability - a fast pitch pitcher vs. a rainbow pitcher is a challenge...). And I certainly do not make anything approaching, or even that could be construed as, a FYC.

That you do is your business, but it is not the noble thing you make it out to be. Quite the opposite. It is not "game management" - it is cheating.