Questioning Partner's Call

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Honestly, IMHO... this added information makes it worse. The fact that coach was barking at him when you decided to add information unsolicited... I can kind of see his ire coming up for that. If he ASKS you for information, that's different. But don't pile on when coach is on him already.

As to what to do now ... I'd be with the herd. Apologize (and I DO think you owe him one ... it's not just taking the high road now), and move on.

I disagree. If he's kicking a rule and you know it, you're just as wrong for letting him kick it as he is for kicking it. You're not overruling or even questioning his judgement. Now, if you're questioning his judgement, that is wrong...but that isn't what we're talking about here. If he says the player controlled it in the front court, the call stands. If he says he only tipped it, then let him know what the rule is and that, by rule, it can't be a violation and leave it to him to take it from there.

I did exactly this a couple years ago with a partner who is probably in the top 2-3 in our association. Throwin on my frontcourt endline is tipped around the FT line (no where near control) and it went into the backcourt where the offense gets the ball. He called a backcourt violation. You can bet I went out to him. He was happy to fix it once I told him that we couldn't have a backcourt violation unless he judged that tip to be player control.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

...
I did exactly this a couple years ago with a partner who is probably in the top 2-3 in our association. Throwin on my frontcourt endline is tipped around the FT line (no where near control) and it went into the backcourt where the offense gets the ball. He called a backcourt violation. You can bet I went out to him. He was happy to fix it once I told him that we couldn't have a backcourt violation unless he judged that tip to be player control.

Difference being in your case you had definite knowledge. In the OP, he "thought" player didn't have control and he was about 40' from the play.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Difference being in your case you had definite knowledge. In the OP, he "thought" player didn't have control and he was about 40' from the play.

Seemed like there was sufficient reason to believe his partner was kicking the rule.

And in my case, when it comes to judgement, there is no definite knowledge. Maybe my partner judged what I saw a as tip to be player control. To me it was obvious. But maybe he saw it differently. Unless I go out there to have the conversation, I would have never know and we'd have both got it wrong.

In the OP, so what if he used the word "thought". That what we judge on most of the time. He wasn't questioning the judgement of his partner, he was asking what his partner had. And if his partner said yes, there was player control, then the discussion was over. If the partner said no, then he should have then added the rule info and let his partner fix it.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I disagree.

There's a HUGE difference between your play, where you're certain the other official made a rule error... and the OP where he thought that perhaps maybe the other official might be mistaken in judgement.

And to do it right after the coach started chewing strips away any semblance of credibility he could possibly have for the rest of that game, perhaps longer should he see this coach in the future. Don't neuter your partner.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

There's a HUGE difference between your play, where you're certain the other official made a rule error... and the OP where he thought that perhaps maybe the other official might be mistaken in judgement.

And to do it right after the coach started chewing strips away any semblance of credibility he could possibly have for the rest of that game, perhaps longer should he see this coach in the future. Don't neuter your partner.

I still disagree. If my partner can't take the heat of getting a rule wrong, that is his problem. He should know the rules...we're not talking about some esoteric corner of the rule book here. If the coach is asking about it, all the more reason to be sure we get it right. He looks worse getting it wrong and not fixing it when he had the chance than he does for getting it right with help.

He wasn't questioning judgement. He was questioning the rule application. If the calling official judged that there was player control, the discussion is over at that point. If not, then we have a rules issue.

Unless you have the conversation, you can't know what he had.