Correcting Partner's Call

[Just Curious]

2 sitch's. I'm the BU... ASA game... 13U.
1. Slide at home. PU, screened out by F2, calls R1 out at the plate. From the 3rd slot I see R1's feet, all the way to her knees cross the plate before the tag on a non-forced play.
2. Batter swings, makes contact on ball with hands, and ball rolls fair. PU wants to give Batter 1st base.
In sitch #2 I know that she shouldn't be given the base, but there weren't any arguments from either team or the fans..
Do you just ignore these actions unless someone asks for help?

Chuck Lewis
Rookie in Ridgecrest, CA

[Gulf Coast Blue]

Yes........don't go to your partner......let them come to you.

Between innings or after the game, talk to him/her about Sit. #2. Ask them what they saw and if they saw the ball hit the batter, go over the rule with them.

Joel

[SamNVa]

Yep, Joel's right. As hard as it is to not speak up in these cases, you CANNOT say anything unless your partner asks you first.

In situation #2, if your partner does not immediately call the ball dead, then you can make the dead ball call and let him know that the ball hit the batter on the hands, but if he then awards the batter 1st, you cannot correct that call unless someone speaks up and your partner comes to you for help.

[Steve M]

Situation normal - I'm going along with Joel & Sam here. Also gonna have a post-game discusion with my partner about #2. #1 we live with, since he made the call, and it's entirely judgement.

Chuck,
Part of these questionable plays can be taken care of in you're pre-game get together with your partner - and all of them should be gone over in your post-game talk. And, like I've suggested before, start keeping a journal/diary of everything weird that happens in your games. Then go back to the rule book & case book and make note of what the calls were and what they should have been.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Sorry, guys, but working on the assumption that there is no doubt in my mind in #2, I'm killing the play, "DEAD BALL! Off the hands, strike on the batter." To be honest with you, with the way some of these young girls swing the bat, you better be damn sure of yourself before calling anything.

I see this as no different than a batted ball off the batter's shin/ankle/foot that the PU does not see. You are not showing your partner up, just making the call s/he didn't see.

[Bandit]

Post game discussion would be interesting....Play #1 would have to ask how PU made call if screened out by F2. Always taught if you can't see the play you can't call an out...Play #2 BU is second set of eyes for balls that may hit batter on pitch or hit...would go along with IRISHMAFIA would have to call dead ball as being helpful to my partner.

[Gulf Coast Blue]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
Sorry, guys, but working on the assumption that there is no doubt in my mind in #2, I'm killing the play, "DEAD BALL! Off the hands, strike on the batter."

Yes........I would agree if I were sure and kill the play.......but isn't it still up to the PU to administer the HBP Strike? If they administer it incorrectly, do you say something?

How's the knee Mike?

Joel

[oppool]

Just a quick note on a little laugh I enjoyed last night.

SIT:I am PU and calling game in which one team is made up of mostly senior umpires 10+years experience anyway at least 8 of them in the field are umps and 2 in the dugout when the other team batter hits one deep to center comes around 3rd but misses the base by a foot at least on both sides then ends up scoring and can you believe it none of the defensive team(umpires)saw it after the inning confirm with the BU he also noted it couldnt believe none of them saw it. So I got to do a little ribbing back. Believe me when you have that many blue on the field it is usally HELL. But fun it will keep you on your toes!!

Mike now I've heard about umpires that dont want call till the weather gets warm but isnt knee surgery going to the extreme. (just kidding) hope it getting better

Thanks

Don

[Bandit]

Joel: Take a look in the Umpire section of the 2001 ASA rule book, page 207 & 208. Because it is the PU responsibility, the BU when helping the PU, should declare DEAD BALL, then shpould hesitate slightly to allow the PU the opportunity to make the call. After the hesitation, if the PU has not made the call,the BU should respond with FOUL BALL call and take the PU off the hook. This represents foul ball/dead balls but I think it could be applied in this threads application as well.

[Edited by Bandit on Mar 20th, 2001 at 05:59 PM]

[IRISHMAFIA]

>>Yes........I would agree if I were sure and kill the play.......but isn't it still up to the PU to administer the HBP Strike? If they administer it incorrectly, do you say something?
How's the knee Mike?<<

That is why I stated it as calling it a strike to hopefully alleviate any question. If my partner hesitates and comes out to ask me if I'm sure, I'm going to kill him. Well, maybe I'll just let him buy the beer, but I'll definitely have a good talk with him/her.

Knee is okay as long as I stay away from the pounding for now.

Thanks,

Mike

[SamNVa]

I agree with calling a dead ball when the pitch hits the hands if my partner doesn't see it, but I'd be hesitant in calling the strike unless it was REAL obvious that the batter actually swung at the pitch as opposed to aborting her swing and attempting to duck the inside pitch. If he chooses to award 1st it could be because he judged that she didn't actually swing at the pitch. I prefer to let the PU determine balls and strikes even on a HBP.

--Sam

[Steve M]

I think Sam's right. I'll kill it right away, but my partner will determine ball or strike - unless he/she asks "did she go?". 'Course, that doesn't appear to be how this example was handled. And, if I have not killed the play with a "dead ball" call, I won't step in later to correct it without being asked. And if I'm asked, I'm also gonna have to 'splain why I didn't kill the play.

[IRISHMAFIA]

I was responding directly to the given situation which specifically states "Batter swings".

I don't guess in this type of situation.