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If the case book says the rule is only enforcable when someone is on the floor, and not on the bench, that meets the definition of "player."
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Situation: Team member A31 is sitting on the bench. He has not played so far in the game. During the 2nd quarter he yells at an official about a foul call and is assessed a technical foul. It is now discovered that he is incorrectly listed in the scorebook as A33. How do you handle this?
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The aspect of participation is what is salient and should be the determining principle in deciding whether a penalty is necessary or not. Quote:
The situation to which you should be making your analogy is a team member with an illegal uniform participating and then departing prior to detection. The ruling for that USED TO BE that it was too late to penalize that player, but a few years ago the NFHS committee changed their position on this and now states that the head coach gets penalized for allowing this no matter when it is discovered. It seems to me that would be a more appropriate precedent in the rules. Quote:
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I'm not disagreeing with the RULE, which is clearly published in the RULES BOOK. I'm disagreeing with the very recent play ruling in the CASE BOOK. It is my opinion that the author erred in writing it. What does one do as an official when the text of the rule doesn't jive with the play ruling? Does one follow the actual text of the rule or should one go with the newly published interpretation? That's the problem. |
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I believe they wrote the case play to specifically address the confusion between "penalized if discovered while being violated" and "penalized when discovered", and the difference between "player" and "team member". The committee feels it is being consistent by making sure a number should be changed, and the penalty enforced, on players only, not team members. Whether you and I agree with the logic is immaterial, we still have to enforce it as written until it is changed. There are many instances where you or I may feel the rules aren't "fair enough", but we still have to abide by them. Correctable error limitations are one obvious area. No "do-overs" are another. This case is yet another. We can argue over some of the philosophies of specific rules and whether one area is consistent with another, but until we get elected to the committee and get in the room and convince them otherwise, we have to simply abide by what they have given us. Quote:
If you feel it their duty to keep track of the correct jersey number because of 2-11-2, submission of roster or substitutions, then they failed to do their job correctly by not notifying us immediately, and the team member has already participated and left, then it's too late to penalize. Just like when it's an official's fault for allowing a sub on the floor illegally, once they're on the floor, it's too late to penalize. Quote:
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M&M's - The Official Candy of the Department of Redundancy Department. (Used with permission.) Last edited by M&M Guy; Tue May 18, 2010 at 10:52am. |
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From Wikipedia: [Sic] "is used when writing quoted material to indicate that an incorrect or unusual spelling, phrase, punctuation or meaning in the quote has been reproduced verbatim from the original and is not a transcription error."
In other words, the word you wanted was "precedent," not "precedence." It was a correct usage of "[sic]", but big, red text, Nevada? That's like giving a coach a technical foul, and telling the crowd, "Hey, everyone! I just T'd up the coach!" |
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I'm really confused as to why there is so much angst about this...if the number in the book has to be changed, it is a T. The only difference that is being discussed here is when it is discovered.
If it is a "player" - someone who is on the court at the time it is discovered - then WE direct the scorer to change the book and administer the T. If it is a "team member" - someone not on the court - then the Coach has the choice of asking that the book be changed (which is a T) or not playing that kid tonight. Why is this causing so much confusion? |
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Some say that a "team member" who previously was a "player" must be added to the book as soon as it is realized, even if they are currently on the bench. Others maintain that the "team member" need not be added unless they wish to reenter the game.
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Owner/Developer of RefTown.com Commissioner, Portland Basketball Officials Association |
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M&M's - The Official Candy of the Department of Redundancy Department. (Used with permission.) |
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M&M's - The Official Candy of the Department of Redundancy Department. (Used with permission.) |
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I'm glad you didn't point out the difference. "Whoever" was the subject of its clause, and thus correctly in the nominative case. "Whomever" would have been wrong.
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Cheers, mb |
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Whoever and Whomever | Grammar Rules
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M&M's - The Official Candy of the Department of Redundancy Department. (Used with permission.) |
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Is that why the book wasn't called "Horton Hears A Whom"?
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Yom HaShoah |
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Yep, my mom used to read that book to me all the time. My fondest memories were when she would read it to me outside while camping; I could hear the owls off in the distance, "...whom...whom..."
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M&M's - The Official Candy of the Department of Redundancy Department. (Used with permission.) |
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example: "Who gave the carrot to whom?" answer: "Whoever gave it to whomever." At least that's how I learned it.
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Sprinkles are for winners. |
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