Looking for consistency

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

How about navy blue under black? You know there is going to be at least one kid

He'll be taking it off.

Black means black.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

He'll be taking it off.

Black means black.

What about faded black? Or what if you have an Opal Black jersey and you wear a plain black undershirt? Does that apply too?

Peace

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I have a question for coaches. Why not have your kids wear the right colors or no undershirt at all and you will not have to worry about what an official says or does not say? As a coach don't you control what your kids wear?

JRut - this would be great! Unfortunately, I personally haven't seen it applied yet.

It is my understanding that it is a requirement that a member of each school have a representative at our State's Mandatory Meeting annually - so they hear it each yr and it shouldn't be a surprise......

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

How about navy blue under black? You know there is going to be at least one kid

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

He'll be taking it off.

Black means black.

I'm color blind, I would literally have to stare at the kids for about 5 minutes to notice.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I'm color blind, I would literally have to stare at the kids for about 5 minutes to notice.

Hopefully, you don't do too many games with a one man crew.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Hopefully, you don't do too many games with a one man crew.

There are have been many games where I would report a team as 'black' and then when my partners have a call I notice them saying 'red'.

In AAU and summer leagues I quite often have to ask players what color they are wearing.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

BTW, I agree that white is not yellow, is not vegas gold nor is it a similar color. White under a gold jersey is not even close.

But understand the spirit of the rule and why it was written -- to prevent confusion. (i.e. undershirts of one team are similar in color to their opponents uniform)

Is white or yellow similar enough to gold that it will not cause confusion? Yes.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by grunewar

3) The uniform “tuck-in rule” is a pet-peeve of ours and we have been instructed to enforce it at all times on the court and not allow players to enter the court if they are not ready.

My pet peeve is guys that don't know how to administer this rule well. It is easy to get kids to tuck in their shirts and you don't have to embarrass them or make a spectacle about it.

I was working with a co-official a few years ago who had just called a very weak foul on a player, giving him his 4th foul. The coach tried to sub in for his player and my co-official didn't want to let the sub in because his jersey wasn't tucked in!

This is a complete lack of game awareness -- he had no idea it was the kid's 4th foul, it was a terrible call to begin with (foul on a blocked shot), and then wants to compound problems by not allowing the sub in! (I told the kid to tuck his shirt in and come in the game)

It's just been my experience that the guys that are hung up on shirttails, undershirt colors, and other minute details of the rules, generally can't referee.

[Amesman]

Originally Posted by Brad

The coach tried to sub in for his player and my co-official didn't want to let the sub in because his jersey wasn't tucked in!

If it's not going to slow or halt the game, just have the kid tuck in his shirt (as you did -- good job) and get him on the floor.

Obviously, removing an undershirt or switching to a different color can't be done without leaving the game area, so that's a different scenario.

Sounds like your partner that game must have been the guy who spends a buck to save 25 cents. Or is so proud of his gold medal, he bronzes it.

[TrojanHorse]

Wouldnt surprise me if they show up in navy...But yes, black should make my life at least a little bit easier.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by Brad

My pet peeve is guys that don't know how to administer this rule well. It is easy to get kids to tuck in their shirts and you don't have to embarrass them or make a spectacle about it.

Not going to disagree on principle here and as the player comes on to the court, I have no problem having them "tuck it in."

I'm just saying what we've been instructed to do - it does slow the game down, "i.e. - "Coach, I need another player as this ones not ready to go." By the time the new player comes off the bench the original player has his shirt in and is ready to go. Guess their "point" is to teach the player a lesson......I'm not a big fan.

[just another ref]

If a kid is at least in the process of tucking the shirt as he enters, I say he's okay. But if this kid has his shirt totally out, and wants to enter, he's out of luck. Why is the shirttail out in the first place? If I'm the coach, I tell my entire team that if they want to play in the game, they need to be entirely ready to go in at a moments notice. This would include the shirttail.

[walter]

Originally Posted by grunewar

Not going to disagree on principle here and as the player comes on to the court, I have no problem having them "tuck it in."

I'm just saying what we've been instructed to do - it does slow the game down, "i.e. - "Coach, I need another player as this ones not ready to go." By the time the new player comes off the bench the original player has his shirt in and is ready to go. Guess their "point" is to teach the player a lesson......I'm not a big fan.

I'm not a big fan either BUT, our association and state association takes the position that the head coach is responsible for the bench personnel and subs and, if a sub comes to the table and attempts to enter with his/her shirt tail out, they don't come in. The rationale is that it is the coach's responsibility to make sure subs are ready and we are justified in not allowing the sub in the game. We are instructed to address this position with the coach's at the pre-game conference and enforce it. We had an official lose a state tournament assignment in a later round becuase he allowed subs to "tuck it in" as they were entering the game from the table. The state rep told him after the game that the head coach had plenty of opportunity to have that sub ready and chose not to do it. The punishment to the coach is his/her sub doesn't come in. The state rep called our assignor and told him not to allow the official to work in later rounds based upon his "non-enforcement" of rules. Pretty harsh but when in Rome...

[Brad]

Originally Posted by walter

We had an official lose a state tournament assignment in a later round because he allowed subs to "tuck it in" as they were entering the game from the table.

This is completely and utterly absurd.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Brad

This is completely and utterly absurd.

Brad, holding your emotions in like this is only going to hurt you in the long run. Let it out, man.