How Long do you hold your stop sign?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I would only have to hold my stop sign for 1.35 seconds.

It is pretty powerful!

You've timed your whistle?

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

It certainly is never a given that a stop sign or any warning must precede a technical foul.

Thank you for posting this.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

You've timed your whistle?

Huh?

I only have to hold my stop sign for 1.15 seconds, not my whistle. Notice my stop sign time decreased since last night. I worked on it after I posted and decreased how long I have to hold it. Stayed up til 2am working on that darn thing.

Oh, one more thing

[Junker]

In this scenario, I'm not sure they would get the luxury of a stop sign. You have one coach stomping and others chiming in. A nice T on the bench would be in order here to me. I'll post about my T last night here in a bit.

[Ref Daddy]

The Stop sign is avisual communication tool.

It should be held as long as needed to get the point across to the Coach.

Look for a positve reaction from the Caoch that the message is recieved and acknowledged.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

In other situations, an immediate "T" might be necessary with no warning, stop sign, etc involved. That depends on the circumstances and the individual tolerance level of the official(sometimes- other times are no-brainers). It certainly is never a given that a stop sign or any warning must precede a technical foul.

Agreed. And for those who might be concerned about depriving the other team of a chance to score when you call a "T": remember, that team now gets two free throws AND the ball back. This concern seems to misprioritize game play over game management, at least in some cases.

[Jway44]

We were actually discussing this situation at a game last night. One of our senior officials who also works the college game reminded us that no matter how bad he is behaving, if you are going to T a coach, always wait until his team has the ball. It just adds a little more insult to the situation. I had never really thought about it, but that is a good idea.

[Junker]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Agreed. And for those who might be concerned about depriving the other team of a chance to score when you call a "T": remember, that team now gets two free throws AND the ball back. This concern seems to misprioritize game play over game management, at least in some cases.

This doesn't apply here since it sounds like one team was running an offense, but remember if you have a fast break situation with an unsporting T, you hold you whistle until after the score. I booted this one earlier in my career. I just thought I'd throw that one out there.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jway44

We were actually discussing this situation at a game last night. One of our senior officials who also works the college game reminded us that no matter how bad he is behaving, if you are going to T a coach, always wait until his team has the ball. It just adds a little more insult to the situation. I had never really thought about it, but that is a good idea.

Can't figure out what additional insult this brings, under ncaa he gets the ball back anyway after the free throws. Also injects a bit of "this is personal" into a process that should be "all business". FWIW.

If you need to T a coach just go ahead and T him.

[Jway44]

Originally Posted by Junker

In this scenario, I'm not sure they would get the luxury of a stop sign. You have one coach stomping and others chiming in. A nice T on the bench would be in order here to me. I'll post about my T last night here in a bit.

The NCHSSA director made it very clear this year, that officials are not to tolorate assistant coaches in any way, shape, or form. He let it be known that "assistants" are to sit on there "***" and be quiet. He stated that the assistants are bench personnel treated exactly like the players that are sitting on the bench. The head coach is 100% responsible for the actions of bench personnel. If the bench (players or coaches) can not behave, then the head coach shall pay for it with a loss of his coaching box.

So in the situation mentioned in this thread, if an assistant coach was making any "noise" toward an official, he should be asessed the T as soon as possible. The stop sign is always a good warning for a head coach. An assistant does not deserve that same privilage.

[Jway44]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Can't figure out what additional insult this brings, under ncaa he gets the ball back anyway after the free throws. Also injects a bit of "this is personal" into a process that should be "all business". FWIW.

If you need to T a coach just go ahead and T him.

This was High School situation, so 2 shots and the ball to the other team. Threrefore you have taken the ball from the offending team, given the other team 2 shots and the ball. There is nothing "personal" about it. Just hold you whistle until his team has possesion. If he is angry enough to deserve a T, then the couple of extra seconds that you hold your whistle will not make any difference, and it may show that you gave him a little longer to calm himself down even though you have already made up your mind to give him the T.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jway44

This was High School situation, so 2 shots and the ball to the other team. Threrefore you have taken the ball from the offending team, given the other team 2 shots and the ball.

You mentioned he's a college official so I assumed he does this for his ncaa games. Or maybe you think his status as a college official gives him more credibility?

In any event it's very bad advice IMO. You start doing this stuff and next thing you'll be making calls/no-calls based on how much you like the coach.

When it's time to T the coach just go ahead and T him. Throw all that other clever BS out the window.

[Jway44]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

You mentioned he's a college official so I assumed he does this for his ncaa games. Or maybe you think his status as a college official gives him more credibility?

In any event it's very bad advice IMO. You start doing this stuff and next thing you'll be making calls/no-calls based on how much you like the coach.

When it's time to T the coach just go ahead and T him. Throw all that other clever BS out the window.

I only mentioned that he is a college official because he is very respected in our association. He has worked numerous NCAA tournament games, and a couple of Final Fours. The advice was based on High School situation. It has nothing to do with liking or disliking a coach, it is just a matter of holding the whistle for a few extra seconds.

I am the last person to go passing out technical fouls, so if I administer one, it is well warranted. So if a coach is behaving that badly, holiding the whistle for another second or two until his team has possesion is just causing him to "loose" as much as he can for his actions. Remember we are talking about a situation where he is going to get T'd up. Not a situation where you are looking for a problem.

We are on the floor for the players, not the coaches. I rarely pay them any attention at all unless there is a dead ball situation and they are asking a question or requesting a time out. Therefore if he is behaving bad enough for me to give him a T, another second or two will not hurt a bit.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jway44

I only mentioned that he is a college official because he is very respected in our association. He has worked numerous NCAA tournament games, and a couple of Final Fours. The advice was based on High School situation. It has nothing to do with liking or disliking a coach, it is just a matter of holding the whistle for a few extra seconds.

I am the last person to go passing out technical fouls, so if I administer one, it is well warranted. So if a coach is behaving that badly, holiding the whistle for another second or two until his team has possesion is just causing him to "loose" as much as he can for his actions. Remember we are talking about a situation where he is going to get T'd up. Not a situation where you are looking for a problem.

We are on the floor for the players, not the coaches. I rarely pay them any attention at all unless there is a dead ball situation and they are asking a question or requesting a time out. Therefore if he is behaving bad enough for me to give him a T, another second or two will not hurt a bit.

OK, so what you're really saying is when a coach gets on your azz IF the other team has the ball and IF you think they are about to turn it over then hold the T. Otherwise T right away. Right?

Interesting policy. What happens if the coach is reaming you a new one while you're waiting for the other team to turn it over but they don't? Or what if the OTHER coach calls a time out?? Then what? You wait for the TO to end and start all over? How long do you wait until you finally give up and T him up when he doesn't have the ball?

To me life is complicated enough already. Coach earns his T, he gets his T right then & there.

Frankly, I don't care if your friend worked EVERY D1 final for the last 20 years. What you heard him say is bad advice. That's all.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

When it's time to T the coach just go ahead and T him. Throw all that other clever BS out the window.

Agreed. Just penalize the act and forget about the analysis.