Ten Second Free Throw Violation ...

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

In my personal opinion, there's no place for this in basketball, but as an experienced basketball official, I'm not touching this with a thirty-nine-and-a-half foot pole. Maybe in my very last game ever, just to take a stand and die on that hill.

And, at the risk of being labeled a sexist, it's mostly girls, most guys wouldn't be caught dead yelling, “Ball, ball, ball”, or “Dead, dead, dead.”

Just sayin'.

[Robert Goodman]

I don't get it...what's shady in basketball about "ball, ball, ball" or "dead, dead, dead"? "Ball" could be a player on offense calling for the ball, or on defense indi cating either that s/he's covering ball or that they need someone else to cover ball. "Dead" could mean any number of things to a particular team.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

I don't get it...what's shady in basketball about "ball, ball, ball" or "dead, dead, dead"? "Ball" could be a player on offense calling for the ball, or on defense indi cating either that s/he's covering ball or that they need someone else to cover ball. "Dead" could mean any number of things to a particular team.

Nothing. And it's completely different from anything a referee would say (well, in that situation) -- but counting is something some officials do (even if they shouldn't) -- that's part of how I make a decision.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

I don't get it...what's shady in basketball about "ball, ball, ball" or "dead, dead, dead"? "Ball" could be a player on offense calling for the ball, or on defense indicating either that s/he's covering ball or that they need someone else to cover ball. "Dead" could mean any number of things to a particular team.

It's not what they say, but how they say it, and how they keep repeating it over and over, trying to get under their opponent's skin, trying to panic their opponent.

Maybe it's alright in some sports, but I personally don't believe that yelling in an opponent's face in an irritating manner when one is only inches away is good sportsmanship in a basketball game.

I would never teach, or allow, the middle school kids I coached to do it.

Is it taunting? Probably not (but it could be). Is is baiting? Probably not (but it could be).

Maybe it isn't unsporting, but it certainly doesn't demonstrate good sportsmanship.

Is this what Dr. Naismith envisioned? What would Jesus do (Jesus Shuttlesworth, Big State University basketball player)?

Like I said, I ain't a "guardian of the game" hero, and as an experienced official I'm not addressing this activity with a thirty-nine-and-a-half foot pole.

But I should.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Is it taunting? Probably not (but it could be). Is is baiting? Probably not (but it could be).

4-18: Fighting is a flagrant act and can occur when the ball is dead or live. Fighting includes, but is not limited to combative acts such as: An attempt to strike, punch or kick by using a fist, hands, arms, legs or feet regardless of whether contact is made. An attempt to instigate a fight by committing an unsporting act that causes a person to retaliate by fighting.

Ball handler A1 picks up her dribble and is unable to immediately find a teammate to pass to. Defender B1 gets inches away from A1 and yells "Dead. Dead. Dead" (repeating it over and over) directly into A1's face in an extremely loud, irritating, annoying, and obnoxious manner, attempting to get under A1's skin, and trying to panic A1. A1 punches B1.

Who gets tossed? Just A1, or both A1 and B1?

I'm not saying that I know the right answer, or that I believe that both should be tossed, but it's certainly worth thinking about.

Just sayin'.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Who gets tossed? Just A1, or both A1 and B1?

This was not a rhetorical question. I am actually interested in the thoughts and opinions of Forum members. It doesn't have to be a debate, just thoughts and opinions.

[Raymond]

I would only eject a non-violent fight participant if they did something unsporting which instigated the fight. I have not seen anything listed in this thread that would fit that criteria.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

I would only eject a non-violent fight participant if they did something unsporting which instigated the fight. I have not seen anything listed in this thread that would fit that criteria.

... An attempt to instigate a fight by committing an unsporting act that causes a person to retaliate by fighting.

Agree. That was the part of the rule that I keyed on, and I would hopefully have the presence of mind to remember that part of the rule, but it the heat of the moment ...