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  #16 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 12:21pm
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I am going to jump into the fray.


First, I am currently registered by the OhioHSAA and the MichiganHSAA for basketball, baseball, and fast pitch softball using NFHS rules. I have been registered in those two jurisdictions for soccer and volleyball using NFHS rules. And was registered by the FloridaHSAA for basketball way back in the day when the NFHS first adopted rules against wearing jewelry.

The NFHS position regarding the wearing of jewelry has been the same for all of the sports for which its writes rules: NO JEWELRY CAN BE WORN EXCEPT FOR MEDICAL JEWELRY (AND RELIGIOUS JEWELRY) FOR WHICH THERE ARE SPECIFIC EXCEPTIONS WHICH ARE DETAILED IN THE RULES!

We, as officials cannot make a player remove his or her jewelry, but we must not allow a player to participate while wearing jewelry. Chapmaja, correctly, allowed the Player and her Head Coach a reasonable amount of time to remove the earring. The Player could not do so, and therefore became ineligible to play per NFHS R3-S2-A12 and R3-S6-A1 Penalty. Since the team had no other substitutes, it was required by rule to play short-handed.

When the Player's turn to bat came she still was not legally equipped to play therefore R3-S3-A8b and R7-S4-A1 are enforced and an out shall be called. The question really before the Forum is can the Player return at a later point in the game, assuming she is now legally equipped, per R3-S3-A8d.

MTD, Sr.
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Last edited by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.; Fri May 17, 2013 at 09:04pm. Reason: Corrected grammer and typo.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 12:27pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
When was she officially removed from the game?
In the bottom of the 2nd....When the umpire told the coach that she could not participate in the game while wearing jewelry and the player did not remove the jewelry and did not participate.

NFHS 2011 3-2-12
Quote:
ART. 12 . . . Players in the game are prohibited from wearing jewelry such as rings, watches, earrings, bracelets, necklaces (including cloth or string types) or other hard cosmetic or decorative items. Religious and medical-alert medals are not considered jewelry. A religious medal must be taped and worn under the uniform. A medical-alert medal must be taped and may be visible. (3-6-1)
EXCEPTION: Unadorned devices, such as bobby pins, barrettes and hair clips, no longer than 2 inches, may be worn to control a player’s hair
So if she's wearing jewelry, she is not in the game...

Also, don't you think it's silly stand there and have to call 3 separate strikes when you know you are not going to see her come to bat?
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 12:36pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
Not really. Not ruling on something I do not see. If I had my druthers, I wouldn't worry about it at all, and don't in ASA, but the reference is Fed.
I have no tolerance for Jewelry and all team know that in my area. When working ASA or other codes I let the coaches know that no player can take the field with jewelry.

Back in the 90's when when I was coaching girls could not wear metal in their hair. I had a a player put old Bobbie Pins ( no covering on the tips) in her hair she slid into second bounced her head which gave her a big gash 3 Stitches to close.

I have also seen a girl rip her ear from an earring getting snagged. Additionally in High School I had a friend lose her ring finger from jumping a fence and getting her ring caught as she was jumping down.

Yes every one of these situation was a freak accident but I do not want to get sued for an accident like these.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 03:32pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane Blue View Post
When working ASA or other codes I let the coaches know that no player can take the field with jewelry.
I don't have my ASA rule book handy. But does it really say no player can take the field with jewelry? I've done a couple of nationals where the UIC said jewelry wasn't an issue as long as it wasn't loose, like hoop earrings.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 03:42pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
I don't have my ASA rule book handy. But does it really say no player can take the field with jewelry? I've done a couple of nationals where the UIC said jewelry wasn't an issue as long as it wasn't loose, like hoop earrings.
In ASA, it is umpire judgment about danger. If judged dangerous, not allowed. PONY and USSSA go with NFHS version.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 04:40pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
I don't have my ASA rule book handy. But does it really say no player can take the field with jewelry? I've done a couple of nationals where the UIC said jewelry wasn't an issue as long as it wasn't loose, like hoop earrings.
As I said I have no tolerance for it. In my judgment it is dangerous.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 05:37pm
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Quote:
I don't have my ASA rule book handy.


R-3 S-6

All protective equipment should be worn properly. If a
player is requested by the umpire to remove jewelry, illegal shoes or illegal parts
of the uniform and they refuse, the player will not be allowed to play.

F. JEWELRY: Exposed jewelry, which is judged by the umpire to be dangerous,
must be removed and may not be worn during the game. Medical alert
bracelets or necklaces are not considered jewelry. If worn, they must be
taped to the body so the medical alert information remains visible.

Last edited by ASA Ump MN; Fri May 17, 2013 at 05:49pm.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 06:12pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CecilOne View Post
Once a team plays shorthanded, the "short" player may not re-enter.

Otherwise, handled fine.
In ASA it is specified that the player who leaves the game and causes a team to go shorthanded may not return to the game for any reason, however I don't find anything to prohibit it in NFHS. If she can finally correct the illegal equipment problem i.e. the jewelry then she may re enter in a high school game.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 06:21pm
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As to when did F5 officially leave the game..when PU noticed the jewelry and requested it be removed and was informed it could not be he told the team she could not play. At that point she has left the game.

If I am PU and I remove a player, I am expecting a substitution so I am going to the coach with my lineup card out. Even if the team turned in a lineup card of nine players only I will still go verify with the coach that the team is playing short. Maybe someone showed up and the team will take their team warning. Might make a "field promotion" from the JV team if they are at the field. Who knows?
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 06:24pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
Did coach tell you he was removing her from the game? No. She was obviously trying to address the issue of jewelry.

Like in the other thread - YOU do not decide when a player is in or out of the game (except, of course, an ejection). When she could not come to bat because she was not properly equipped, you rule a penalty strike. 3 of those and THEN she's out, but she's not removed from the game.

Then you don't have the problem of letting her back into the game - she was never out of the game.
So when she is on defense, as was the case when she was noticed on DEFENSE with the jewelry on, I should have allowed her to stay in the game correct? A player not legally equipment CAN NOT remain in the game. That is pretty clear.

I gave her plenty of time to attempt to remove the illegal item and when she was unable to do so, I informed the coach we were going to play ball. Which in this case means the player is removed from the game. That is very clear. What is not clear is allowing the player to return to the game.

I can not find anything in the rules that DOES NOT allow her to return to the game when she has been forced to leave the game for some reason.

To me this is no different than if she had been forced to leave the game, was replaced by a substitute, then was re-entered under the re-entry rule. I have found NOTHING in the rules that says once a player leaves the game and the team is forced to play shorthanded, the team must remain shorthanded.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 08:59pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane Blue View Post
As I said I have no tolerance for it. In my judgment it is dangerous.
Are you the type to make a player remove a wedding band?

I have little tolerance for people who .......nevermind, not worth the keystrokes.

If the jewelry is not, IMJ a danger to another, I don't consider it dangerous, period. If people want to wear something which would be dangerous to themselves, and only themselves, I really don't care.
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Last edited by IRISHMAFIA; Fri May 17, 2013 at 09:07pm.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 09:10pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane Blue View Post
As I said I have no tolerance for it. In my judgment it is dangerous.
I really don't think this is the kind of thing that should be a personal decision -- it should be agreed to by the umpires groups in the area.

Having you make players take it all off while another umpire doesn't just leads to people thinking that we're all arbitrary and capricious in nature.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 09:22pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
Are you the type to make a player remove a wedding band?

I have little tolerance for people who .......nevermind, not worth the keystrokes.

If the jewelry is not, IMJ a danger to another, I don't consider it dangerous, period. If people want to wear something which would be dangerous to themselves, and only themselves, I really don't care.
I agree. If the player and/or parents (of youth) deem it OK - who am I to disagree. However, Mike, not all sanctioning bodies see it that way. So, what I see kinda depends on what rules we're using.

Unlike some, I do not remind folks, in a scholastic game, at a plate meeting to remove jewelry. The players certainly know what rules are being used and so do their coaches.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old Fri May 17, 2013, 09:32pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UmpireErnie View Post
In ASA it is specified that the player who leaves the game and causes a team to go shorthanded may not return to the game for any reason, however I don't find anything to prohibit it in NFHS. If she can finally correct the illegal equipment problem i.e. the jewelry then she may re enter in a high school game.
This is what I read in the rules as well for Fed as well. I can find 3 rule references to playing short handed in the Fed rulebook. 4-3-1f, 4-3-1g, and 7-4-1.

4-3-1f deals with with a team not having 9 players to start a game.

4-3-1g deals with a team not having 8 players to continuing playing.

7-4-1 deals with a batter not being able to bat and an opening in the batting order.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old Sat May 18, 2013, 02:13am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
Are you the type to make a player remove a wedding band?

I have little tolerance for people who .......nevermind, not worth the keystrokes.

If the jewelry is not, IMJ a danger to another, I don't consider it dangerous, period. If people want to wear something which would be dangerous to themselves, and only themselves, I really don't care.
Actually it's a standing joke that they can wear a wedding ring if their parents allowed them to get married.

Our State interpreter has instructed us to keep jewelry off the field (fed) other than what is permitted by rule. As far as ASA I only allow adult players to wear jewelry other than hoop earring.

As I said earlier I do not want to get sued. and remember I am in California where parents will sue you for any thing they can.
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