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  #16 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 30, 2007, 09:33pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoBits
I'm curious as to the answer. No one else seems to be.

I'm rethinking my answer though. If the BR had already touched first base, then ran past R3, then R3 is no longer entitled to first base,
Why not? What is keeping R3 from returning to 1B? Then again, why would R3 continue after the third out of the inning has been executed?
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old Fri Mar 30, 2007, 11:44pm
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You want newbies? How about non-umps?

Assuming it is ASA fastpitch and 12U or above, I see it like Wadeintothem, all the way down to his description of R3.

R1 and R2 left their bases legally after the pitch, and scored before the 3rd out, which was when BR passed R3.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old Sat Mar 31, 2007, 03:25am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
Why not? What is keeping R3 from returning to 1B? Then again, why would R3 continue after the third out of the inning has been executed?
If they're too stupid to come in out of the rain (or be off and running with two outs), they're likely one of those candidates to keep going with 3 outs...
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old Sat Mar 31, 2007, 11:45am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bkbjones
If they're too stupid to come in out of the rain (or be off and running with two outs), they're likely one of those candidates to keep going with 3 outs...
No argument there, John. However, I'm really more interested in the response to the first two parts of my post.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 02, 2007, 12:19pm
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Guess this one was easier here than at our meeting the other night. Some normally rules-savvy umpires were having trouble with the idea that even though the sitch provided had BR passing unintentionally, a bright BR could do this intentionally to prevent a tag on R3 (which WOULD nullify the runs, obviously)

Should have known this group would be smarter than the general populus.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 02, 2007, 11:19pm
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Let me get this straight...

The force out at 2nd would have obviously nullified any runs scored on the play, but by R3 running backwards and being passed by the BR, the 3rd out was called on the BR and was not a force.

Tagging 2nd would have prevented the runs. Chasing R3 backward did not. Interesting.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 03, 2007, 06:46am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tribefan1952
Let me get this straight...

The force out at 2nd would have obviously nullified any runs scored on the play, but by R3 running backwards and being passed by the BR, the 3rd out was called on the BR and was not a force.

Tagging 2nd would have prevented the runs. Chasing R3 backward did not. Interesting.
If the defense does their job and catches the ball in flight, no runs would score.

If F4 plays for the force at 2B, no runs would have scored unless the BR passes R3 prior to a play at 2nd.

Don't feel bad for the defense, their inept play gave the runs to the offense, not the rule book.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 03, 2007, 10:32am
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Would it be possible for the defense to go for the 4th out of the inning to get the force out at 2nd and nullify the runs due to the force ?
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 03, 2007, 10:44am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by umpire george
Would it be possible for the defense to go for the 4th out of the inning to get the force out at 2nd and nullify the runs due to the force ?
I think a fourth out is only recognized in an appeal situation, correct?
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 03, 2007, 11:57am
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What force out at 2nd? The BR is retired, so R3 is no longer forced to 2nd and can retreat to 1st, no?
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 03, 2007, 01:26pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by umpire george
Would it be possible for the defense to go for the 4th out of the inning to get the force out at 2nd and nullify the runs due to the force ?
There is no fourth out available, nor is there a force out available.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 03, 2007, 01:48pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JefferMC
What force out at 2nd? The BR is retired, so R3 is no longer forced to 2nd and can retreat to 1st, no?
Yes..........
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 11, 2007, 11:36pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
Speaking ASA SP.

None, either R1 or R2 is out for leaving the base prior to the ball reaching the plate.
Actually, I think you're referring to 8-7-R. If so, then I'll have to disagree with ya there. Since it was phrased "as the ball crosses the plate," I'm going to assume that the ball has reached the plate. In that case, both runners, leaving at that exact (yeah, right... I know, I know... no such thing) moment should be fine.

I'm with wadeintothem on this one, but hey... I've been known to be wrong, even when I'm right.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old Thu Apr 12, 2007, 06:33am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCASAUmp
Actually, I think you're referring to 8-7-R. If so, then I'll have to disagree with ya there. Since it was phrased "as the ball crosses the plate," I'm going to assume that the ball has reached the plate. In that case, both runners, leaving at that exact (yeah, right... I know, I know... no such thing) moment should be fine.

I'm with wadeintothem on this one, but hey... I've been known to be wrong, even when I'm right.
Originally, the OP stated the runners were off with the pitch. The author since then had edited the scenario.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old Thu Apr 12, 2007, 09:47am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA
Originally, the OP stated the runners were off with the pitch. The author since then had edited the scenario.
Ahhh... Then touche. You'd be absolutely correct, sir!
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I haven't decided if I should call it from the dugout or the outfield. Apparently, both have really great views!

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