Missed Base With Bases Loaded

[EricH]

Originally Posted by BretMan

For USA the appeal is considered at the time of the appeal, not the time of the infraction. So, for them, this is not a force out.

This is not actually true. Read the Point of Emphasis regarding third out appeals. It clearly states that a missed base remains a force out if appealed. The "time of the appeal" comes into play only when a succeeding runner is retired prior to reaching the base to which he was forced, removing the force out. The force was not removed when the runner was retired AFTER reaching the base to which he was forced. The force would have only been removed if he were retired BEFORE reaching second base.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by EricH

This is not actually true. Read the Point of Emphasis regarding third out appeals. It clearly states that a missed base remains a force out if appealed. The "time of the appeal" comes into play only when a succeeding runner is retired, removing the force out. The force was not removed when the runner was retired AFTER reaching the base to which he was forced. The force would have only been removed if he were retired BEFORE reaching second base.

R1 was out before the appeal.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by EricH

This is not actually true. Read the Point of Emphasis regarding third out appeals. It clearly states that a missed base remains a force out if appealed. The "time of the appeal" comes into play only when a succeeding runner is retired prior to reaching the base to which he was forced, removing the force out. The force was not removed when the runner was retired AFTER reaching the base to which he was forced. The force would have only been removed if he were retired BEFORE reaching second base.

Actually, it is true.

The RS being quoted by BretMan was added in 2004. BTW, USA/ASA hasn't used the term "Point of Emphasis" since 2006.

[Manny A]

FWIW, here's a USA Softball case play from May 2009:

Does the Run Count? R1 on 3B, R2 on 2B and R3 on 1B with two outs, B6 hits a shot into right centerfield. R1, R2 and R3 score before B6 is thrown out at 2B for the third out. F5 yells that R2 missed 3B and ask for a fourth-out appeal. The umpire rules R2 out on a fourth-out appeal and declares the force back into effect and no runs score.

Ruling umpire’s ruling was incorrect, here’s why.

The fourth-out appeal is correct because Rule 5, Section 5, C stipulates, “no run shall score if a “fourth out” is the result of an appeal of a base missed or left too soon on a runner who has scored.” Therefore R2 can be properly appealed and called out as the umpire ruled.

However, the force out is incorrect. Rule 1, Definitions, Force Out: An out which may be made only when a runner loses the right to the base that the runner is occupying because the batter becomes a batter-runner, and before the batter-runner or trailing runner has been put out.” Also according to Rule 5 Section 5B [1] “No run shall score if the third out of the inning is the result of a batter-runner being called out prior to reaching first base or any other runner forced out due to the batter becoming a batter-runner. On an appeal play, the force out is determined when the appeal is made, not when the infraction occurred.” On this play the force would not be in Effect, R2 would be called out on the fourth out appeal and R1 would score.