Ball status

[youngump]

Originally Posted by jmkupka

Don't we treat any kick, intentional or otherwise, that causes the ball to enter DBT the same way we treat any throw (besides a pitch), intentional or otherwise, that causes the ball to leave DBT?

That seems to be the point of the rule clarification. But if you take that point, then what is the point of the word intentionally in 8-5-K. And then our local direction here is that a pitched ball at rest unintentionally kicked out of play is one base time of pitch.

[BretMan]

Originally Posted by youngump

That seems to be the point of the rule clarification. But if you take that point, then what is the point of the word intentionally in 8-5-K. And then our local direction here is that a pitched ball at rest unintentionally kicked out of play is one base time of pitch.

Then this would stink...

Runner on first, stealing with the pitch. Pitch bounces off the catcher and rolls over by the dugout. As catcher chases ball, runner rounds second and heads for third.

If I'm the catcher I'm going to use my best acting skills to "accidentally" kick the ball into the dugout when I try to retrieve it. Doing so puts the runner back on second base, instead of at third base.

I've always thought that this would be a two-base award, from the time of the "kick". But I can see how the case play might not be too clear about that.

[jmkupka]

Actually Bret, in your scenario a 2-base award would put the runner at home (if he'd rounded 2B before the kick)...

[Tru_in_Blu]

Originally Posted by jmkupka

Actually Bret, in your scenario a 2-base award would put the runner at home (if he'd rounded 2B before the kick)...

That would be true on a batted or thrown ball.

Since it's a pitched ball, it would only be a 1 base award from TOP.

[BretMan]

Originally Posted by jmkupka

Actually Bret, in your scenario a 2-base award would put the runner at home (if he'd rounded 2B before the kick)...

Right. If we assume it is indeed a two-base award (which I do).

I was replying to the poster that said this would be a one-base award from the time of the pitch. Under that scenario, the runner would be forced to go back to second base. Without the "kick" the runner would have achieved third (no base awards involved). I was trying to illustrate that the "one-base, time of pitch" assumption would be entirely unfair to the offense and the the defense could gain an advantage by "accidentally" kicking the ball out of play.

My interpretation would be to award home (two-bases, time of kick).