Snap before ready to play

[Robert Goodman]

And according to what was written in a thread here about a week ago, in NCAA, you've got a real problem, since they're not required to "chop", whistle, or otherwise signal the RFP if the 40-sec. rule is in effect. Team A has no notice other than looking at the chain crew of whether they're allowed to snap the ball or not.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

And according to what was written in a thread here about a week ago, in NCAA, you've got a real problem, since they're not required to "chop", whistle, or otherwise signal the RFP if the 40-sec. rule is in effect. Team A has no notice other than looking at the chain crew of whether they're allowed to snap the ball or not.

The notice is that if ball is on the ground but it cannot be snapped yet, the umpire will tell the snapper not to snap the ball.

[bisonlj]

Originally Posted by Welpe

The notice is that if ball is on the ground but it cannot be snapped yet, the umpire will tell the snapper not to snap the ball.

Correct. Sometimes I hold up the snap because I'm waiting for others on the crew to get back to their positions. The RFP is essentially when I step back (Rule 2-2-4a: A dead ball is ready for play when with the 40-second play clock running, an official places the ball at a hash mark or between the inbounds marks and steps away to his position). I'll ask the QB to please give me a second or two to get out of harm's way but they technically can snap it as soon as I step back. It can be dangerous in the middle.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

And according to what was written in a thread here about a week ago, in NCAA, you've got a real problem, since they're not required to "chop", whistle, or otherwise signal the RFP if the 40-sec. rule is in effect. Team A has no notice other than looking at the chain crew of whether they're allowed to snap the ball or not.

Spoken like someone who has never been on the field. What a load of nonsense.

Next Saturday, find a team that runs the hurry up and watch the umpire.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Spoken like someone who has never been on the field. What a load of nonsense.

Next Saturday, find a team that runs the hurry up and watch the umpire.

Sorry, no time to watch stuff played by NCAA, coaching our own game. In fact, the last time I watched a game played by NCAA, this sort of thing was R's responsibility, not U's.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Sorry, no time to watch stuff played by NCAA, coaching our own game. In fact, the last time I watched a game played by NCAA, this sort of thing was R's responsibility, not U's.

Fair enough, but if you've not seen an NCAA game in recent memory, perhaps suggesting that the NCAA has problems with a particular rule is not really in your wheelhouse.

Also ... I don't believe the R has spotted the ball in the NCAA in the last ... um ... ever.

[jTheUmp]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Also ... I don't believe the R has spotted the ball in the NCAA in the last ... um ... ever.

Depends on the crew... the mechanics manual says that either the R or the U can spot the ball, although in practice most crews I've seen/worked with let the U spot the ball in almost every situation. The main exception seems to be on a sack with a large loss of distance (15+ yards); then a lot of times the R will spot the ball before the U gets there.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Fair enough, but if you've not seen an NCAA game in recent memory, perhaps suggesting that the NCAA has problems with a particular rule is not really in your wheelhouse.

Also ... I don't believe the R has spotted the ball in the NCAA in the last ... um ... ever.

Ever is a long time. For a very long time that was strictly R's responsibility--starting with when they stopped having team A's snapper put the ball down at the linesman's spot. But it's good they gave that to U, who had more free time once subs stopped having to report to him--and even more free time in 5+ crews when they gave the 25 sec. clock to the BJ.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Ever is a long time. For a very long time that was strictly R's responsibility--starting with when they stopped having team A's snapper put the ball down at the linesman's spot. But it's good they gave that to U, who had more free time once subs stopped having to report to him--and even more free time in 5+ crews when they gave the 25 sec. clock to the BJ.

My 1939 rulebook (the earliest I've been able to find ... I collect these) doesn't say one way or another (no mechanics section at all). My 1947 book has a brief mechanics section but doesn't include this, and in the rule it just says "the official". Ditto 1949 and 1952. 1955 specifies spotting the ball as a duty of the umpire.

Does anyone have a copy (or link to) the Waynesburg / Fordham game in 1939 - we could look and see.

In any case, I would still hope you might refrain from saying the NCAA has a problem with a rule since you've not seen a game in quite a while. Maybe?

[Suudy]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Does anyone have a copy (or link to) the Waynesburg / Fordham game in 1939 - we could look and see.

Well, found some video of Pitt/Fordham from 1937.

Pitt at Fordham Football 1937 Polo Grounds (Part One) - YouTube



Edit: Or perhaps better yet, Princeton/Yale from 1910. Watch about 30 seconds into the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcfoKTjHhIA



Looks like the official in the backfield spots the ball (and winds the clock).

[parepat]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

And according to what was written in a thread here about a week ago, in NCAA, you've got a real problem, since they're not required to "chop", whistle, or otherwise signal the RFP if the 40-sec. rule is in effect. Team A has no notice other than looking at the chain crew of whether they're allowed to snap the ball or not.

Not true in this scenario. You would have a ready for play due to the first down.