Taking a knee

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

That's what's so frustrating with having a real conversation with you here. You assume he's talking to you (he wasn't ... he quoted the person he was replying to), and you say crap like "no one here said ..." when SEVERAL people have said EXACTLY that and/or parts of that... including the person he was responding to. Go re-read the thread if you don't believe me. YOU might not say or imply what he was referring to... but a LOT of referees do including many here - and it's flat wrong.

Actually he and others are taking a position, it has nothing to do with me specifically other than I was one that took an opposite position from him and others. If that bothers you that I responded, then maybe these boards are not for you. People are going to respond to anyone's comments regardless of who stated them. I have not run into a single board where people do not take sides and there is a possible debate. And in this discussion it was implied that people said something that was not said. I did read all the comments and not one said anything that was accused. Now if someone in another thread made that comment, then addresses their comments. But what people do here is they disagree with someone and they add to the points of the discussion that were never addressed. No one here said anything about telling players not to hit each other, but every response suggested that very thing was advocated. I also think that Jason and I kind of understood each other in the end, which is why we have these discussions in the first place even if you do not agree all the time.

Peace

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If that bothers you that I responded, then maybe these boards are not for you.

It doesn't bother me at ALL that you responded.

It bothers me that you got all bent out of shape that he dare disagree with someone else (not you) who said something - and you further go on to say that no one is saying the EXACT thing that was said. It was your tone of denigrating him for misunderstanding YOU when he was not even replying to you.

The fact remains that MANY here are saying exactly what you claim no one is saying. I have very little issue with the way you say you personally handle this situation, especially given that it seems to be common in your area. I have LARGE issues with the fact that some officials (some I've worked with, even) will flat out tell the offense they can't run a play - and tell the defense what the offense is doing. Frankly, unless told by the higher ups in the region or state, our job is to OFFICIATE - not to coach. And definitely not to tip off either side. At the VERY MOST - I can see an official saying something like, "OK, defense, IF the offense takes a knee, don't be stupid." But I've heard referees tell teams "OK, relax! They are taking a knee here - I don't want to see anyone moving." It really chaps my hide.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

It doesn't bother me at ALL that you responded.

It bothers me that you got all bent out of shape that he dare disagree with someone else (not you) who said something - and you further go on to say that no one is saying the EXACT thing that was said. It was your tone of denigrating him for misunderstanding YOU when he was not even replying to you.

What is bent out of shape to you? Other than responding to this thread, I do not think I thought much about what was said here. I do not even think I even discussed this situation with my crew or anyone else. So being out of shape is a little much doing you think? I do not recall throwing anything at the computer screen. Stop it with the hyperbole.

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

The fact remains that MANY here are saying exactly what you claim no one is saying. I have very little issue with the way you say you personally handle this situation, especially given that it seems to be common in your area. I have LARGE issues with the fact that some officials (some I've worked with, even) will flat out tell the offense they can't run a play - and tell the defense what the offense is doing. Frankly, unless told by the higher ups in the region or state, our job is to OFFICIATE - not to coach. And definitely not to tip off either side. At the VERY MOST - I can see an official saying something like, "OK, defense, IF the offense takes a knee, don't be stupid." But I've heard referees tell teams "OK, relax! They are taking a knee here - I don't want to see anyone moving." It really chaps my hide.

You showed one guy who I missed a specific comment. And when this thread was started he was not even in the conversation. I am not here to defend every single person and their position on this issue. This like many other issues has layers to them. So I am not sure how "many" made such a claim either way other than there are folks that put everyone on the opposite position in the same boat. This is also why way back in the beginning of this thread someone said do what applies in your area. Those expectations will vary just like everything else we talk about here (rules application, mechanics, administrative policy) are all going to ultimately be based on what is accepted or not accepted in your area. And this issue is certainly one of them.

Forgive me for missing one of the many with the same or similar handle. But I do not recall seeing many saying anything in concert with one another from my point of view.

Peace

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

What is bent out of shape to you?

This:

Originally Posted by JRutledge

This is what is so frustrating with having a real conversation with many here. You take words and place them in people's arguments because you do not agree with it. No one here said anything about preventing someone getting hurt or stop from someone playing hard.

You showed one guy who I missed a specific comment. And when this thread was started he was not even in the conversation.

One guy? It was the one you responded to with "This is what is so frustrating". The guy you actually said this TO is the one that specifically did not do what got you so "frustrated". You responded to HIM that he takes words and places them in people's arguments.

No offense, but this REALLY isn't that hard to follow.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

This:

One guy? It was the one you responded to with "This is what is so frustrating". The guy you actually said this TO is the one that specifically did not do what got you so "frustrated". You responded to HIM that he takes words and places them in people's arguments.

No offense, but this REALLY isn't that hard to follow.

Yes, I am soooooooooo offended. Maybe I will jump out the first floor window that I am currently sitting at.

Frustration and being offended are two totally different things. I realize that for you this is probably your life to have a discussion here and to come after me, but this is passing time for me. I am trying to finish a project and in-between doing that and some things around where I am located. I take a position to discuss things, not to get upset with people I will never have to work with over what is said here. I think I am good without guys like you and if you disagree with something I do so be it. It is Week 5 year and we have 4 more to go until the post season. Have a great season the rest of the way, I know I will.

Keep up the good work.

Peace

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

One guy? It was the one you responded to with "This is what is so frustrating". The guy you actually said this TO is the one that specifically did not do what got you so "frustrated". You responded to HIM that he takes words and places them in people's arguments.

No offense, but this REALLY isn't that hard to follow.

Try nailing jello to a wall lately?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Try nailing jello to a wall lately?

Mmm. Yes, good point. Realized that just now when he introduced a whole new adjective that I never said or implied, and claimed it's different than what I did say. Whatever. I'll take your advice and stop fighting this windmill.

[JRutledge]

Just for the record I just read this discussion about what happens near the end of the game on another site which involves people specifically from my state (and someone that comes here from time to time as well). The exact same position was stated and the individuals talking are not directly from my area. Several officials said that they tell the defense they are taking a knee and use preventative officiating like I have suggested. You can argue whatever you like but it appears that this is a regional issue where this is accepted in some areas and not in others. Like said long time ago, do what those do in your area and leave it at that.

Peace