Kicked PAT

[Texas Aggie]

NCAA: Backjudge is the only one with the whistle even in his mouth to blow. However, defenses can return the PAT for their own score in our rules. The BJ will blow as soon as the ball passes them (or hits the EZ untouched), look at the LJ (or FG), say "Yes," or "No" and then they both signal. Obviously, the one making the call on their side will initiate the yes/no.

I guess another question is, regardless of code, which official makes the call if the two under the uprights for whatever reason disagree?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Theisey

If you use standard NFHS mechanics (5-man), the R whistles the play over if and only if the TRY is blocked. Otherwise, the BJ takes the whistle.

We don't. Oh well.

I would if I could count on a strong, consistent whistle, but I can't. So I blow it. It hasn't done us in yet.

If I worked NCAA rules, I would not (BTW).

[bisonlj]

Originally Posted by Reffing Rev.

Blowing the whistle as soon as the ball clears, while accepted in many locations is technically speaking an IW as the ball doesn't become dead until either the kick is successful or obviously unsuccessful.

Whenever an official is certain the PAT kick is unsuccessful he should blow the play dead. Whenever any official...R, BJ, whatever.

Slower on the whistle prevents mistakes. Especially in FED when their is a difference between PAT and FG. SLOW DOWN.

I'm waiting for the first coach to call a time out to discuss a rule interpretation on this. He's technically right so you can't charge him a time-out. You'll have to appeal to his common sense and explain that while technically you had an IW, you are not going to call it in this instance.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by bisonlj

I'm waiting for the first coach to call a time out to discuss a rule interpretation on this. He's technically right so you can't charge him a time-out. You'll have to appeal to his common sense and explain that while technically you had an IW, you are not going to call it in this instance.

That would cost the coach a time out and the conference would be very short, indeed.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by bisonlj

I'm waiting for the first coach to call a time out to discuss a rule interpretation on this. He's technically right so you can't charge him a time-out. You'll have to appeal to his common sense and explain that while technically you had an IW, you are not going to call it in this instance.

Then again, the instant you realized what this fool was asking for the time out to discuss, you could simply ignore him and go on with your regular duties. If he wanted to make an issue out of it, he has the absolute right to complain to the appropriate authorities, which would only clarify to them what a fool he is.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Then again, the instant you realized what this fool was asking for the time out to discuss, you could simply ignore him and go on with your regular duties. If he wanted to make an issue out of it, he has the absolute right to complain to the appropriate authorities, which would only clarify to them what a fool he is.

Which is what I would do. I'd tell him to ask for me if he had anything to actually discuss and get myself to the goal line, where I belong.

[NorCalRef12]

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie

NCAA: Backjudge is the only one with the whistle even in his mouth to blow. However, defenses can return the PAT for their own score in our rules. The BJ will blow as soon as the ball passes them (or hits the EZ untouched), look at the LJ (or FG), say "Yes," or "No" and then they both signal. Obviously, the one making the call on their side will initiate the yes/no.

I guess another question is, regardless of code, which official makes the call if the two under the uprights for whatever reason disagree?

The way we work it is the BJ and LJ are under the uprights, each official has his upright and the BJ has the crossbar all the way across. There shouldn't be any disagreement.

If the BJ didn't have an opinion on the cross bar he can ask for help, but the LJ shouldn't speak up about the crossbar unless asked. Each official has their own area of responsibility, they shouldn't officiate in another officials area.

[movingthechains]

We use the back judge for whistle and crossbar, the HL or LJ has the other post depending on if the Kicker is a righty or lefty

[Canned Heat]

Originally Posted by Theisey

If you use standard NFHS mechanics (5-man), the R whistles the play over if and only if the TRY is blocked. Otherwise, the BJ takes the whistle.

That's what we do now. My former crew once worked with our white hat a long ways off from the goal line (54 yard attempt...kid made 50 earlier) and whistled a long FG kick dead when he thought it had crossed the goal line and it hadn't. Ugly IW.

[bisonlj]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

That would cost the coach a time out and the conference would be very short, indeed.

Except he would technically be right! The whistle sounded before the ball went through the uprights. That kills the play right there. I agree he's being silly but what would you tell him?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by bisonlj

Except he would technically be right! The whistle sounded before the ball went through the uprights. That kills the play right there. I agree he's being silly but what would you tell him?

(Never mind.)

Frankly, this whole discussion is silly. I'd probably tell the coach he was being silly, too, and let the wing deal with him.

[NJumpire9]

IN NJ, BJ has the whistle in a 5 man crew, and R only if the kick is blocked.

[jTheUmp]

On my (MN) crew, our BJ sounds the whistle when the ball clears the upright. If the kick is blocked, it's either the R or one of the wing officials.

Not sure if other states do this or not, but in MN we have the BJ and U under the uprights on all trys and FG attempts.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by jTheUmp

On my (MN) crew, our BJ sounds the whistle when the ball clears the upright. If the kick is blocked, it's either the R or one of the wing officials.

Not sure if other states do this or not, but in MN we have the BJ and U under the uprights on all trys and FG attempts.

Who watches the line play and for roughing the snapper?

[InsideTheStripe]

Originally Posted by jTheUmp

On my (MN) crew, our BJ sounds the whistle when the ball clears the upright. If the kick is blocked, it's either the R or one of the wing officials.

Not sure if other states do this or not, but in MN we have the BJ and U under the uprights on all trys and FG attempts.

You'll never see a U under the pipes in my state.

My crew puts the LJ under the pipes regardless of the foot of the kicker. I've seen others in the area that put either wing under the pipes with the BJ depending to the foot of the kicker.