Incorrect travel

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by tref

1989 mind-set

PCA means PRIMARY COVERAGE AREA not EXCLUSIVE COVERAGE AREA & if its your PRIMARY its probably someone elses SECONDARY.

TRUST YOUR PARTNERS but help em out when they are staightlined, when they dont position adjust, when they're looking where they shouldn't be & get the damn play right!

Nobody is losing by 1 point in my games because of the IC plays I described.
Talking about it after the game may help the official (who doesnt belong on the court this time of year if they dont know those basics) but it doesnt do justice to the GAME or the participants involved in the 1 point loss.

Tref:

1989 mind set!! Listen up whippersnapper! I have forgotten more about basketball officiating and still know more than you do about basketball officiating. You do not know the first thing about basketball officiating. You don't know difference between officiating your PCA and officiating Off Ball outside of your PCA. If you and I were on the same officiating crew and you tried to pull that horse manure with me, I would rip you a new tuchus at halftime.

MTD, Sr.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Tref:

1989 mind set!! Listen up whippersnapper! I have forgotten more about basketball officiating and still know more than you do about basketball officiating.

MTD, Sr. ftw.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

MTD, Sr. ftw.

Jugs:

I am getting senile. What is "ftw'? If you have to PM with your answer go ahead.

MTD, Sr.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Jugs:

I am getting senile. What is "ftw'? If you have to PM with your answer go ahead.

MTD, Sr.

ftw = for the win

Took me about a year to figure that out

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Toren

ftw = for the win

Took me about a year to figure that out

Toren:

Thank you.

MTD, Sr.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Tref:

1989 mind set!! Listen up whippersnapper! I have forgotten more about basketball officiating and still know more than you do about basketball officiating. You do not know the first thing about basketball officiating. You don't know difference between officiating your PCA and officiating Off Ball outside of your PCA. If you and I were on the same officiating crew and you tried to pull that horse manure with me, I would rip you a new tuchus at halftime.

MTD, Sr.

1. You never seen me work, so you're assumption of my abilities means nothing to me.
2. I would never be on any court with you as I have already graduated from your brand of basketball.

As for you doing anything to me physically... you really don't want to be labelled as an internt thug, do ya?? If you were talking verbally, I'd simply walk away as I do with most old timers that haven't camped in over a decade

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by tref

2. I would never be on any court with you as I have already graduated from your brand of basketball.

I'd simply walk away as I do with most old timers that haven't camped in over a decade

Wow...

As one who can tell you flat out that I have worked levels of basketball that you have not made it to, this post right here tells me all I need to know about you.

The attitude expressed in that post will cost you in the future. At some point you will take that attitude toward someone and then find out that they are in a position to cause you grief.

Either lose the attitude, or expect that whatever championship it was that you worked will be the highest level you will make it to.

Disagree with people all you want. Argue rules, mechanics, positioning, call selection, etc., etc. But the BS you spewed in that post WILL hurt you if you don't get it under control and keep it under control.

[tref]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Wow...

As one who can tell you flat out that I have worked levels of basketball that you have not made it to, this post right here tells me all I need to know about you.

The attitude expressed in that post will cost you in the future. At some point you will take that attitude toward someone and then find out that they are in a position to cause you grief.

Either lose the attitude, or expect that whatever championship it was that you worked will be the highest level you will make it to.

Disagree with people all you want. Argue rules, mechanics, positioning, call selection, etc., etc. But the BS you spewed in that post WILL hurt you if you don't get it under control and keep it under control.

Wow...

So Mark gets to blast me & quite frankly, threaten me over the internet, but I cannot retort. Okay

Isnt he the one that posts about 3rd grade games ALL the time??
I simply said I've graduated from his brand of basketball so we wouldn't be on the same court anytime soon. WTF?

Already made it past that C'Ship level the following summer, but thanks anyway

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by tref

Wow...

So Mark gets to blast me & quite frankly, threaten me over the internet, but I cannot retort. Okay

Isnt he the one that posts about 3rd grade games ALL the time??
I simply said I've graduated from his brand of basketball so we wouldn't be on the same court anytime soon. WTF?

Already made it past that C'Ship level the following summer, but thanks anyway

From things you have posted, I know that you have the opportunity to move to higher levels in your career. I offered you some advice and your response is to make excuses and point your finger at other people, and try to downplay the attitude that you exuded in your earlier post.

Like I tried to say before - that crap will come back to bite you if you don't get it under control now.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

From things you have posted, I know that you have the opportunity to move to higher levels in your career. I offered you some advice and your response is to make excuses and point your finger at other people, and try to downplay the attitude that you exuded in your earlier post.

Like I tried to say before - that crap will come back to bite you if you don't get it under control now.

Yep, if it seeps out here no doubt it does else where. And there will be a point when there are 5 equally talented candidates competing for 2 spots and then the conservation turns to "well, what kind of feel to you get from ####?, what have you heard about him?" and the boss turns his mentor, the old guy who never sniffed the NBA or a NCAA Final Four but helped guide the boss to where he is today.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by tref

Wow...

So Mark gets to blast me & quite frankly, threaten me over the internet, but I cannot retort. Okay

Isnt he the one that posts about 3rd grade games ALL the time??
I simply said I've graduated from his brand of basketball so we wouldn't be on the same court anytime soon. WTF?

Already made it past that C'Ship level the following summer, but thanks anyway

You might want to check which Mark you're referring to....there is more than one. And the level of ball a person choose to work doesn't necessarily indicate how good of an official they are. There are other reasons people work games.

As long as Mark (either one) can get down the court, I'd take him any day over some young punk who thinks they're better than all the other officials on the court and that their view of a play is the only view. Officials that constantly "cover" their partner's "misses" eventually find they don't have any partners to work with.

I see what I think are wrong calls by my partners probably every game. Sometimes, with partners I'm comfortable with, I bring it up in post game (or half time). Some of those times, I find out I was wrong...there was an element to the situation I hadn't seen. Sometimes, it is splitting hairs (perhaps deciding whether the player had control or not) and neither is more right than the other. Sometimes I was right...I saw something they didn't see. And, a few times, I'll step in on the court and give them more info.....but it has to be something absolutely necessary before I do.

[APG]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Tref:

1989 mind set!! Listen up whippersnapper! I have forgotten more about basketball officiating and still know more than you do about basketball officiating. You do not know the first thing about basketball officiating. You don't know difference between officiating your PCA and officiating Off Ball outside of your PCA. If you and I were on the same officiating crew and you tried to pull that horse manure with me, I would rip you a new tuchus at halftime.

MTD, Sr.

I'm sorry, but LOL @ this...this smacks of a partner that NEVER, EVER wants an official to call in his primary area.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

I'm sorry, but LOL @ this...this smacks of a partner that NEVER, EVER wants an official to call in his primary area.

Come on now....we're talking about making violation calls that are close and tough to see from 40 feet away where it is more likely a matter of judgement than a matter of who is right...and I'm going with the guy 10' from the play over the lead who is 40' away and shouldn't even be looking that on a play that is not by any stretch of the imagination an OMG play. If he had come in to get it, we may very well have had another poster writing about a partner who made an AT&T call and got it completely wrong.

Plus, I have a hard time believing the trail was looking at backs and butt on a trap at half court but the lead had a clear view into the play...that seems like the trappers were on the wrong side of the play and the offensive player would have had a clear path to the basket....or the description is not quite accurate.

[APG]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Come on now....we're talking about making violation calls that are close and tough to see from 40 feet away where it is more likely a matter of judgement than a matter of who is right...and I'm going with the guy 10' from the play over the lead who is 40' away and shouldn't even be looking that on a play that is not by any stretch of the imagination an OMG play. If he had come in to get it, we may very well have had another poster writing about a partner who made an AT&T call and got it completely wrong.

Plus, I have a hard time believing the trail was looking at backs and butt on a trap at half court but the lead had a clear view into the play...that seems like the trappers were on the wrong side of the play and the offensive player would have had a clear path to the basket....or the description is not quite accurate.

I would rather see a clip before I'm 100 percent whether the lead should have been looking out there. I could envision a scenario where the lead could be looking out there. From what tref has told us, his partner was glad he got the additional information. Plus the people who assigned him the game said the particular plays were egregious and important enough to where the additional information given on the play was the right thing to do. Obviously, he did something right. And ultimately, the tape will prove whether he was right or not.

I guess I had more of a problem with how MTD responded more than anything. We can debate whether the off-ball official could/should have/or not helped with additional information, but that's exactly what this should be...a discussion. No need to imply incompetence by saying tref has no idea or concept about something as simple as PCA's or officiating off-ball outside one's PCA.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

I'm sorry, but LOL @ this...this smacks of a partner that NEVER, EVER wants an official to call in his primary area.

APG:

You didn't read what I said. I do not have a problem with a partner who officiates Off The Ball (OfTB) out of his PCA. When there are ten players on the court and the game is being officiated by a Two-Person Crew (TwPC), that type of officiating is very important. But if the OfTB official is a Ball Watcher, then there can and will be problems. I and many other esteemed members of this Forum have stated before, when an official is Ball Watching outside of his PCA, bad things can and will happen.

Tref gives me the vib that he is a Ball Watcher. The Three-Person Crew (ThPC) was created so that there will be times when there will be two eyes On The Ball (OnTB) and four eyes OfTB, and that there will be times when there will be four eyes OnTB and two eyes OfTB. In the latter situation there will one official will be considered the Primary Official OnTB and the other official will be considered the Secondary Official OnTB, and ball and location and where the play started will dictate who is who (or is it whom is what, LOL?); that type of knowledge comes from experience.

MTD, Sr.