that coach!

[dacollegegirl]

I am at my wits end with this coach! It is a school coach. My son (the 4th grader) wasn't getting his homework done, so I figured that I had to tell him if homework doesn't get done, that he could no longer play ball.
His teacher decided to give him a break and let him play. I decided to give him a second chance as well. Well, as things went, he's homework started slipping and I had to stand by my word that he turn his jersey in.
After my 5th grade daughter's ball game tonight, my son told me that when he turned his jersey in earlier during school hours, that the coach said something like, "well, that's one less person to have to worry about." I about blew my top!
I have half a mind to change schools, but maybe this is a lesson "someone" is trying to get through to me. I don't know! Any advice?

[Jurassic Referee]

Take it to the school principal.Comments like that to Grade 4 kids are just way out of line.

[Rock'nRef]

My humble advice....

First off, take a deep breath and just think about it for a few days. I agree that you did the right thing by sticking to your guns with your son. I would speak to the coach to verify that your son's memory of the coach's reply is correct. If his reply is indeed the way your son stated, I would strongly make a point to the school that he was out of line. There is the chance that he was having a horrible day and may apologize to you for his statement. Most coaches are very competitive by nature and he may have reacted with a hot head. There may be more to the story than you are aware. Parents have the right to fight for what they feel is the proper way to treat their child but I would be sure of all the facts before I made a hasty reply.

Regarding the thought of pulling your child from the school because of this incident. PLEASE.. GET A GRIP... If you have your children's best interest in mind regarding school, you should be most concerned about the QUALITY of education that they are receiving. To pull a child out of a strong academic school (if indeed yours is) because of a poor reaction of a coach is way out of line to me. That's just a personal opinion (and I do recall what they say about opinions!!).

Good Luck. I hope that things work out for the best. Of almost every retired coach that I speak to, the number 1 reason why they gave up coaching is because of dealing with parents. I just ask that you give him/her a fair chance before you decide how to handle it.

RR

[ScottParks]

Originally posted by dacollegegirl
It is a school coach. My son (the 4th grader) wasn't getting his homework done, so I figured that I had to tell him if homework doesn't get done, that he could no longer play ball.
His teacher decided to give him a break and let him play. I decided to give him a second chance as well. Well, as things went, he's homework started slipping and I had to stand by my word that he turn his jersey in.

The other parts of this aside, thank you for having the focus that our children are in school primarily for an education.... sports is secondary.

The rule in my household for playing sports (as well as other outside activites) directly pertains to the ability of the child. My son (our oldest) is and has been an A student. His rule was always "no A, no play" He questioned at first why this was so much stricter that the Texas policy of "no pass, no play" and we told him.... "Because you are capable of doing that level of work".

We challenged our son and daughters to excel in school while playing sports AND we haven't had to invoke the consequences of the rule yet.

(knock on wood)

[Ridge Wiz]

I agree with the advice to step back & take a deep breath. I'm a parent to a 7th grade cheerleader & 4th grade basketball player. I also coach rec league & officiate HS JV & below. So I've heard some coaches & parents make bad staments.
Nobody has yet recommended a direct conversation with the coach who made the comment. What if someone thought you made a comment like the one your son brought home and refused to speak directly to you about the sitch. Personally, I would appreciate you comming to me as a concerned adult and not someone head-hunting. If/When you do some face time with the coach, by all means let his supervisor know of any inappropiate remarks. I would think at the age of your son that you could change him to a good coach,i.e. AAU, YBOA or Jr. Pro, easier than changing his school.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by dacollegegirl
I am at my wits end with this coach! It is a school coach. My son (the 4th grader)...

I have half a mind to change schools, but maybe this is a lesson "someone" is trying to get through to me. I don't know! Any advice?

Is this the same coach that was berating the players, who you told us about a couple weeks ago? If so, he's got to go! This comment is absolutely inexcusable. No one should EVER say that about anyone of any age, but especially someone that young. I feel sorry for this guy's own kids. They are in a world of hurt!

Don't change schools, but get on the board that chooses coaches. Insist on humane values, and sportsmanship above winning. Recruit other parents to back you up. I'm sure you're not the only one who feels this way.

In the short run, when you talk to him about his comment, puke on his shoes for me. If you can't quite pull that off, call our friend here Mark Padgett and he'll do it for you!

[dacollegegirl]

Originally posted by rainmaker

Is this the same coach that was berating the players, who you told us about a couple weeks ago?

Yes, I am the one who posted a few weeks ago about the same coach (coach behavior). I have tried to talk to him and the superintendent about his actions. Coach is not willing to "cow down to a parent" and the super has no problem with his coaching. Is this how most rookie coaches act?

I was going to try to face-to-face with the super this morning with my son, but it would have made him late for class, and he is scared. I can undertand his feelings because of the first incident with my 5th grade daughter, she got dogged by all her classmates that day. (And I only said that I had half a mind to change schools.)

I called the super this morning and stated my concern. She said she will talk to the coach. But in my opinion, she did not sound to pleased to do so. And honestly, I feel that because this is his first year as a coach, he will say anything to save face with the school.

And another question, How does kids learn to play the game if they barely, or rarely, get to play at the games? It is my opinion that all kids play no matter how bad they play, especially at this age level. Not bench them just because they didn't participate in p.e class. (Isn't it his job to encourage them to play in p.e. class?)

Ok, enough ranting, sorry for taking up alot of space...

[Ridge Wiz]

college girl,
Is this how most rookie coaches act?
No, I don't think any respectable coach acts this way.

I called the super this morning and stated my concern. She said she will talk to the coach. But in my opinion, she did not sound to pleased to do so. And honestly, I feel that because this is his first year as a coach, he will say anything to save face with the school.
I would want all three parties to be in the meeting. That way you know exactly what is/isn't said to the coach. Of course, the super/coach will meet w/o you.

And another question, How does kids learn to play the game if they barely, or rarely, get to play at the games?
I beg to differ. Nobody learns how to play during the game. They learn how to play in practice. That's why you practice more than you play. I hear parents say they don't want their kid to try for the middle school team in the 5-6th grade because they won't get as much playing time as they would in our "youth" league. I don't agree. Our youth league practices one hour on 1/2 of the court & plays one game per week. However, the middle school practices 3 or 4 times per week for about 2 hours using the whole gym. They also play 1, 2 or sometimes 3 games per week.
Best of Luck to you.

[RecRef]

Originally posted by Ridge Wiz
college girl,
And another question, How does kids learn to play the game if they barely, or rarely, get to play at the games?
I beg to differ. Nobody learns how to play during the game. They learn how to play in practice. That's why you practice more than you play. I hear parents say they don't want their kid to try for the middle school team in the 5-6th grade because they won't get as much playing time as they would in our "youth" league. I don't agree. Our youth league practices one hour on 1/2 of the court & plays one game per week. However, the middle school practices 3 or 4 times per week for about 2 hours using the whole gym. They also play 1, 2 or sometimes 3 games per week.
Best of Luck to you.

Will you please take a step back and reread what you wrote. No 10 to 12 year old child should be subjected to 6 to 8 hours of practice plus up to 6 hours of games a week! They do not have the emotional maturity to handle such. This is to say nothing of the mental fortitude to stick to their studies. This is ludicrous.

Mom, put your child in a youth league, let him have fun. Send him to local summer basketball camps to learn his skills. When he gets into high school you can talk about that amount of practice. When he gets into HS he can go to a national camp. A few years back we sent our #1 son to Coach K’s at Duke when he was ready for it.

[Hawks Coach]

Originally posted by Ridge Wiz
And another question, How does kids learn to play the game if they barely, or rarely, get to play at the games?
I beg to differ. Nobody learns how to play during the game. They learn how to play in practice. That's why you practice more than you play. I hear parents say they don't want their kid to try for the middle school team in the 5-6th grade because they won't get as much playing time as they would in our "youth" league. I don't agree. Our youth league practices one hour on 1/2 of the court & plays one game per week. However, the middle school practices 3 or 4 times per week for about 2 hours using the whole gym. They also play 1, 2 or sometimes 3 games per week.
Best of Luck to you.

I somewhat agree, but I am firmly in the camp that you learn different things in each environment. I want to practice more than we play, but you can see a big difference in players who practice only and players who get substantial playing time. I trimmed my roster this year (to some parents' chagrin) because I knew that certain players would not get enough court time on my team and needed to go elsewhere so they would obtain necessary game experience.

Practice is essential for building good skills and habits, but substantial game time teaches you how to cope with the things that you see only when you play other teams. And we practice hard, but there is no substitute for game intensity.

[RookieDude]

I would submit to you, dacollegegirl, that you may consider "punishing" your child with something other than sports.
To take away a child's experiences that he/she gains by participating in sports...not to mention the physical benefits he/she gains, is not doing anybody any good.
If you have to take away a "privledge"...why not let it be his/her T.V. time, or Video time, or phone time (older kids), or Movie time, or a host of others.
Keep them in sports!
RecRef stated that to subject a kid to 6 or 8 hours of practice a week is "ludicrous". That may be a bit much...but how many hours a week do you think these kids spend in front of the boob tube?
And ScottParks...WOW!...am I ever glad I wasn't your kid!
"No A...No Play"? That's putting a bit too much pressure on the kid, isn't it? Are you performing at the "A" level at your job? Or better yet, are you performing at the "A" level of your officiating career? (better than 90% of the other officials in your association)
Those are great goals...but to punish one because he/she cannot attain those lofty heights seems somewhat overbearing...IMO.

Dude

[LarryS]

Yo, Dude!

Scott is in my chapter and while I cannot attest to the "better than 90% of the other officials", he is excellent...not that he needs me to defend him.

Also, even as a lover of sports (and a pathetic athlete) I will point out that school sports, regardless of the level, are a priviledge. The education of the student is paramount! That is, afterall, the reason we have schools.

When I was in high school (in Texas before No Pass, No Play) I was in the band (see pathetic athlete and a baseball coach that was a jerk). We had a academic standard of 85 or better in every class to participate. No exceptions, no excuses. We also had strict dress codes, conduct codes, etc. Didn't like them, fine...quit. Worked out pretty well for us, both in and out of class.

When my son was in high school, his standard was 85 or better or no extracirricular activity. He has turned out wonderfully (honor grad from HS, NHS, gold medal in Academic Decathlon, Eagle Scout and honor student at Baylor working to become a minister). Same standard for my daughter. I will point out like Scott, my children have and continue to establish they are capable of performing at that level in their studies. If other activities cause their grades to drop, they lose that activity (be it sports, cheerleadings, TV, etc.). I only expect them to do their best.

You may call that unfair or unreasonable...I call it parenting.

[Hawks Coach]

I am firmly in the camp of letting parents set the standards. I have had parents withhold basketball from some of my players as a punishment, and I support their decision. If it is their favorite thing, sometimes it is what you need to take away in order to get results. Of course, I would recommend removing the video games and TV from the equation first, because those are waste activities compared to a sport. But sometimes the most important thing to a kid is what you need to deny to get through to them.

And yes, the A standard sounds tough, but if a kid was achieving As before sports, he should continue to achieve and not allow their sports activities to cause their education to suffer. I have always expected my kids to achieve higher than the minimum standard, and they in turn expect it of themselves.

I have learned from working, coaching, and parenting that the leaders set expectations - and parents and coaches are the leaders for their children and their players. Low expectations almost always result in low performance. High expectations and appropriate positive reinforcement (helping them get there) will always result in higher level performance.

[ScottParks]

Originally posted by Hawks Coach
I am firmly in the camp of letting parents set the standards. I have had parents withhold basketball from some of my players as a punishment, and I support their decision. If it is their favorite thing, sometimes it is what you need to take away in order to get results. Of course, I would recommend removing the video games and TV from the equation first, because those are waste activities compared to a sport. But sometimes the most important thing to a kid is what you need to deny to get through to them.

And yes, the A standard sounds tough, but if a kid was achieving As before sports, he should continue to achieve and not allow their sports activities to cause their education to suffer. I have always expected my kids to achieve higher than the minimum standard, and they in turn expect it of themselves.

I have learned from working, coaching, and parenting that the leaders set expectations - and parents and coaches are the leaders for their children and their players. Low expectations almost always result in low performance. High expectations and appropriate positive reinforcement (helping them get there) will always result in higher level performance.

THanks, coach. That was exactly my point. He was achieving these grades before sports.... why should sports be an excuse to allow his grades to slide.

LarryS. Thanks for the defense and compliment.

[ScottParks]

Originally posted by RookieDude
And ScottParks...WOW!...am I ever glad I wasn't your kid!

Dude

Me too

No A...No Play"? That's putting a bit too much pressure on the kid, isn't it? Are you performing at the "A" level at your job? Or better yet, are you performing at the "A" level of your officiating career? (better than 90% of the other officials in your association)
Those are great goals...but to punish one because he/she cannot attain those lofty heights seems somewhat overbearing...IMO.

Dude

Seriously, we aren't discussing my performance here. We are discussing the performance of one of my children. His capabilities were and still are as an A student. I personally believe that sports have no place in defining a reduced importance or expectation for this performance. Sports in an EXTRA-curricular activity and a privelage.

I also tailor these expectations based on the capabilities that my wife and I observe in all of our children. Each child's capabilities for grades are different... our expectations are the highest for each of them, but our realistic goals are determined by their capabilities.