SIU Time Out

[stiffler3492]

Youngref, you are correct. However, in the video, the official is already granting timeout, then points at a player other than #2.

I'm questioning nobody's integrity. I'm questioning the play. I think it's certainly possible that the official realized he messed up after the fact, then tried to cover his behind with a weak story.

I'm all for giving fellow officials the benefit of the doubt, but there's something that just doesn't sit right with me on this one. I'm not saying that his integrity was compromised in any way. It's quite possible that he made a mistake (Oh my, officials make mistakes??!!??), and did a poor job afterwards.

It's easy for me to play armchair quarterback here, I'm just giving my opinion. If you want to discredit that because I'm willing to question what happened, so be it. Everyone on this board (including myself), has been critical of another official on this board, sometimes in a condescending way. If we can be critical on each other while interpreting a rule, why can't we be critical of a real situation that ended up being instrumental in deciding the outcome of a game?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

I'm questioning nobody's integrity.

Really?

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

I'm questioning the play. I think it's certainly possible that the official realized he messed up after the fact, then tried to cover his behind with a weak story.

You don't see the part in red as an issue of integrity?

There are really only three options here:
1. It happened as the official stated it did.
2. He's convinced a player made a verbal request, but the player didn't make the request.
3. He realized he goofed, but stuck to his guns and issued the T anyway.

#2 is an issue of competence.
#3 is competence and integrity.

From your own comments, the video does not show the ref was in error. So you're basing your opinion on the official's competence on what, your gut?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

The official told the table that "He heard someone from SIU yell timeout"

And you think that the official is a liar? What basis do you have for that conclusion except your very own take on the play, a take that is not supported by a shred of evidence to back it up btw.

Maybe it's just me, but I always like to go along with an official unless there's evidence that he actually did screw up. And I haven't read anything factual so far in this thread proving that he did so, just conjecture. Y'all go ahead and dump on the guy though. Personally I'll wait until I find out if there really is a reason to dump on him though.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Until evidence shows otherwise, I'll choose to believe the explanation that is more charitable to the officials involved (both their competence and their integrity). You seem willing to question one or both; based on what?

Gee, you think like an official, not a fanboy.

Why aren't I surprised?

[stiffler3492]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

I'm not doubting that he heard the word "timeout" come from someone, somewhere. Could have been the crowd behind him. Maybe it was a savvy opponent who knew that SIU had no timeouts left?

I'm not accusing the official of lying.

I'm just stating what I think could have happened. Never once did I say this is what happened. I've been trying to think about all the possible situations and explanations.

I've been in loud arenas before, and I can only imagine what the noise is like down on the floor at the end of a close game. I never accused the official of anything, because you're right. I have no hard evidence. Neither do you. I'm just hashing out the possibilities.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

I'm not accusing the official of lying.

I'm just stating what I think could have happened. Never once did I say this is what happened. I've been trying to think about all the possible situations and explanations.

I've been in loud arenas before, and I can only imagine what the noise is like down on the floor at the end of a close game. I never accused the official of anything, because you're right. I have no hard evidence. Neither do you. I'm just hashing out the possibilities.

You're saying he might have lied, then, based on nothing but conjecture.

Allow me to summarize your statements. Don't worry, I'll try to be charitable.

"It just seems fishy. Maybe the official lied. Maybe he's just wrong."

Has the coach or player even denied making the verbal request?

If the evidence shows the official lied, I'll dump on him.

[stiffler3492]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

You're saying he might have lied, then, based on nothing but conjecture.

Allow me to summarize your statements. Don't worry, I'll try to be charitable.

"It just seems fishy. Maybe the official lied. Maybe he's just wrong."

Has the coach or player even denied making the verbal request?

If the evidence shows the official lied, I'll dump on him.

Snaq you're exactly right. Where's the crime in this? Why are you getting on me for throwing possibilities out there? That's all I'm doing.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

Snaq you're exactly right. Where's the crime in this? Why are you getting on me for throwing possibilities out there? That's all I'm doing.

No crime, fanboy. Officials expect that treatment. It comes with the territory.

And we officials are territorial.

[stiffler3492]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

No crime, fanboy. Officials expect that treatment. It comes with the territory.

And we officials are territorial.

Damn right we are. I just don't get why nobody else can acknowledge the fact that there are other possibilities. We don't get everything right all the time.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

Snaq you're exactly right. Where's the crime in this? Why are you getting on me for throwing possibilities out there? That's all I'm doing.

Honestly, because you're dumping on an official without evidence. You have the "right" to do it, and I have the "right" to call you out for it. There's nothing that suggests the officials' story is anything less than truthful, so why offer conjecture that casts them as dishonest and incompetent? I just don't understand that desire.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

Damn right we are. I just don't get why nobody else can acknowledge the fact that there are other possibilities. We don't get everything right all the time.

If we know that an official screwed up, we do discuss it, see if we can learn from it and maybe even dump a l'il on the poor goober that screwed up. We all screw up at some time; that's a given.

What most of usually don't do is crap on any official without hearing their side of the story or having some kinda actual proof that they really did screw up.

Try putting yourself in that official's position. You may have made the absolutely correct call in your mind and know for a fact that a TO was requested by the team that didn't have one left, but people are crapping on you without asking you for the details. Or, if you do give someone the details, they just simply say "I don't believe that", just like you're doing now.

That's where we're coming from.

[stiffler3492]

I'm right with you guys. No doubt about it.

All I'm doing is throwing out possible explanations for what happened...nothing more. I'm done arguing about this because I've said all I can say.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by stiffler3492

I'm right with you guys. No doubt about it.

All I'm doing is throwing out possible explanations for what happened...nothing more. I'm done arguing about this because I've said all I can say.

I can ask one of the officials directly if you like. I did not see the game and there is no guarantee that person will tell me what happened as they are not obligated. But I sure can ask.

Peace

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

You're saying he might have lied, then, based on nothing but conjecture.

Allow me to summarize your statements. Don't worry, I'll try to be charitable.

"It just seems fishy. Maybe the official lied. Maybe he's just wrong."

Has the coach or player even denied making the verbal request?

If the evidence shows the official lied, I'll dump on him.

You forgot "He might have had money on the game. He might have graduated from the other school. He might have had a grudge against the coach. He might have been trying to make a "make-up" call."

No, stiffler didn't say any of those. But they're all in the same vein.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

You forgot "He might have had money on the game. He might have graduated from the other school. He might have had a grudge against the coach. He might have been trying to make a "make-up" call."

No, stiffler didn't say any of those. But they're all in the same vein.

To be fair, it's possible he was thinking those things. There's no proof he wasn't.