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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 08:38pm
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Moving Picks with Video question??

Hey guys,

I am not a Ref, but the dredded parent

Sorry but I have a 9 year old girl in Basketball and we played this one team that sets picks on every offensive play bringing the ball down the court.

Ok, great no problem. Except almost everytime they come running to set the pick it is moving and they come from behind and wrap their arms around our girls, move with us, or hook us.

I was just begging for fair calls. The first game we got no calls and this happened like 20 times I kid you not. This game I was determined for our girls to try and beat it. Coach said go under the pick, I learned one thing YOU CANNOT GO UNDER MOVING PICKS, THEY ARE ALLWAYS moving with you. I tried to yell moving picks and the refs seemed to not even know what was going on. And I will tell you why. These girls all bunch up so it appears that the girl is running in to get a pass from the ball carrier but oh not so Mr Ref
they are wrapping up our girls.

Anyway here is just a few of the clips on my webspace. I can add more of the same but I will run out of webspace but it went on the whole game. You can see the Ref looking right at them. Why no calls?

Basket Ball Video

Sorry, this probably not the place to post this but would like your opinon and suggestions on calmly how to discuss with a Ref.

It was truly brutal to watch the whole game like this. They practically tackled our girls and in one of them they did. I left the audio in so I guess you can hear I am a little frustrated at this .

Can two girls set picks on both sides of you, moving at that, and can they put their arms out wide ?

Thanks, Lostdog...Yes sorry but my first post.
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:06pm
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First of all there is no such rule as "moving screen." Screens are allowed to move all the time and be legal. Also screens can be still and illegal, which is why the term should not be used. Time and distance applies to screens so at the time of contact all that is relevant was a screener giving the proper time and distance before contact.

And I just watched the first video. And if you want to have a serious conversation about basketball, first of all show some kids that are older and everyone is not in practice gear. Get a grip, it appears these are little girl's games where the kids can barely walk and chew gum yet. This did not even look like middle school kids.

Peace
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Last edited by JRutledge; Sun Feb 21, 2010 at 09:14pm.
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:11pm
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Thanks for the laugh
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:14pm
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Well, I watched the videos.

(1) I'd rather claw my eyes out than work a game like this.

(2) The attempts to screen where the players hold, hook, and grab are clearly illegal -- team control fouls. If these aren't being called, you should just save money on officials.

(3) The one called "doublepicksmov" has nothing illegal in it. Players moving around your players without contact are doing nothing illegal. You can't have a foul here without contact. Period.

Please learn #3. And if you live near me, #1. Unless you are paying $50 a game or more, in which case I'll be happy to take your money for an hour's "work."
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:16pm
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I guess I should add that this league is man to man and no zone defense allowed if that matters.

Lostdog
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:16pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostdog View Post
k:

Sorry but I have a 9 year old girl in Basketball and we played this one team that sets picks on every offensive play bringing the ball down the court.

I was just begging for fair calls.

Sorry, this probably not the place to post this but would like your opinon and suggestions on calmly how to discuss with a Ref.
Oh no, this sureasheck IS the place to post this.

Nine year old kids? In a freaking rec league? With student refs that probably have never had any formal training?

Are you kidding me?

Whatintheheck is the matter with you? Get a grip on yourself. These are freaking young kids that are out there trying to have some fun. And they don't need whining, crybaby parents like you spoiling their fun.

Do everybody in that league a favor. Drop your kids at the door and then go home. They don't need parents like you around.

If you have any more questions, please don't hesitate to ask. we'll always be here for you.


Lah...freaking me......
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:22pm
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and we wonder what has happened to sportsmanship. . .

I looked at the videos you linked us to, and one thing is obvious to me. This is going to be difficult, and perhaps even offensive for you to hear, but it is true. You, and parents like you, are why kids in high school athletics have little or no concept of sportsmanship.

What in the world are you thinking? Moving pick???? Are you SERIOUS???? In the first video, the dribbler loses the basketball, and then secures it while on her knees on the floor, and we can hear you yelling about a moving pick in the background. Assuming, for the sake of argument, that it really WAS a moving pick, did it work? Was the girl who was on her knees given some sort of advanatage by virtue of the alleged moving pick?

I next moved on to the "double pick" video. There are two girls who are trying to set a pick. I can see no contact whatsoever as a result, so in answer to your question, there is no foul. But that is the least of our concerns here. I couldn't bring myself to look at the other clips, but I'm sure they are more of the same.

As you sit in the stands yelling at the teenagers who are trying to officiate something that only remotely resembles a basketball game, exactly what is it that you are trying to teach the children? If things go wrong, make sure you find someone else to blame?

I want you to try and picture something in your mind. Imagine how that game would look if the referees called each and every foul, and each and every violation, that occurred in the game. I'd be willing to bet that you couldn't go more than 20-30 seconds without having a whistle blow. And then you could start yelling "come on, they're just kids, let them play" instead of "moving pick, moving pick!!"

Honest to God, sir, you need to take a really hard look at yourself. You are so obsessed with making sure your daughter's team wins that you take the time to post video from a grade-school basketball game so you can tell someone "yeah, I asked some real referees, and they say we got cheated." And please don't come back with that "we just want a fair shake" baloney. I'm sure that for every "moving pick" that was missed against the other team, there were countless travels, double dribbles, 3-seconds, lane violations, etc., etc. that your team got away with as well. That's how it works when LITTLE CHILDREN play basketball. It isn't about winning. It's about learning.

What are YOU teaching them???
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:22pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee View Post
Oh no, this sureasheck IS the place to post this.

Nine year old kids? In a freaking rec league? With student refs that probably have never had any formal training?

Are you kidding me?

Whatintheheck is the matter with you? Get a grip on yourself. These are freaking young kids that are out there trying to have some fun. And they don't need whining, crybaby parents like you spoiling their fun.

Do everybody in that league a favor. Drop your kids at the door and then go home. They don't need parents like you around.

If you have any more questions, please don't hesitate to ask. we'll always be here for you.


Lah...freaking me......
I answered straight up, but I was thinking this.
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:27pm
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Pretty comical!
Sit back, mellow out, relax and enjoy.

#1. It's not real basketball.
#2. It's not real officials.
#3. It's not real coaches.

Looks like supervised recess.
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:30pm
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Fair enough guys. I will do the best I can to learn from your suggestions. Been a tough day and I thank you for some honest feedback.

Lost dog
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:30pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichMSN View Post
I answered straight up, but I was thinking this.
I agree and I wanted to say things worse. But I am trying to live a Christian lifestyle.

Peace
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Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:37pm
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This was so painful to watch. Ouch. I can't even remember coaching at that level......

I hear these parents and coaches every weekend. Thankfully, small consolation, I never take games at this young an age anymore.....I just can't do it/take it.

As Clint Eastwood would say, "A man's got to know his limitations." And that's one of mine!
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:43pm
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Video link won't work for me.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 09:45pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostdog View Post
Fair enough guys. I will do the best I can to learn from your suggestions. Been a tough day and I thank you for some honest feedback.
Personally I think you should be able to get on this board and ask questions without being ganged up on.

Your question was valid, albeit premature for this level of play. The mechanics of basketball are barely identifiable until kids get into around 6th grade and higher. Ref'ing a game like that is VERY challenging because these kids can barely control their bodies, to say nothing of truly understanding the dynamics of the game.

Having said that, you have the right to come onto this board and ask a question anytime. And we ought to be able to answer it with at least some level of professionalism and manners.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 21, 2010, 10:04pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul LeBoutillier View Post
And we ought to be able to answer it with at least some level of professionalism and manners.
Oh, is that right? The same professionalism and manners that this individual used when he was screaming at a couple of teen-aged officials, trying to intimidate them into making calls in his 9-year old daughter's favor?

Know what, Paul? Every year I have to talk to the officials that are quitting our association because they feel that it just isn't worth taking the abuse any more that they have to take from the stands. So, feel free to sympathize with these whiny parents. I'll think that I'll stick with my fellow officials.
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