Finally I have seen one, first touch after....

[mutantducky]

Does anything change on this-

So team A throws the ball in from the endline into their backcourt. Pass is caught controlled by A1 thus establishing control. Ball then is fumbled and tipped around. If a player from Team A OR Team B is the last to touch it in the backcourt and tips it into the frontcourt where it is again batted around by Team A or Team B. Ball goes into the backcourt. Team A gets control of the ball- violation?

I'm thinking yes it is a violation in either case. Even if team B touches it last(without control, loose ball) in the backcourt and again touches it again in the frontcourt, it would still be a violation if Team A gets the ball in the backcourt. So even if Team A did not touch the ball in the frontcourt they could still be called for a violation? That would be a really weird play.
If it is, do you call the violation right when Team A touches the ball in the backcourt after it had gone in the front or when they have control of the ball? Example, ball backcourt then frontcourt and then back, B1 knocks it off A1 while in the backcourt. Call it there?

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

Does anything change on this-

So team A throws the ball in from the endline into their backcourt. Pass is caught controlled by A1 thus establishing control. Ball then is fumbled and tipped around. If a player from Team A OR Team B is the last to touch it in the backcourt and tips it into the frontcourt where it is again batted around by Team A or Team B. Ball goes into the backcourt. Team A gets control of the ball- violation?

I'm thinking yes it is a violation in either case. Even if team B touches it last(without control, loose ball) in the backcourt and again touches it again in the frontcourt, it would still be a violation if Team A gets the ball in the backcourt. So even if Team A did not touch the ball in the frontcourt they could still be called for a violation? That would be a really weird play.
If it is, do you call the violation right when Team A touches the ball in the backcourt after it had gone in the front or when they have control of the ball? Example, ball backcourt then frontcourt and then back, B1 knocks it off A1 while in the backcourt. Call it there?

No. If B is last to touch the ball before it goes into the BC, it's not a violation.

[mutantducky]

Ok- so the key is if B is the last to touch. A can touch it in the FC but as long as B touches it last before it goes back into the BC then it isn't a violation. kind of like the case book play, where on a looseball in A's fc b slaps it off A1's leg and A recovers it, violation because A1 last to touch it in the FC.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

Ok- so the key is if B is the last to touch. A can touch it in the FC but as long as B touches it last before it goes back into the BC then it isn't a violation. kind of like the case book play, where on a looseball in A's fc b slaps it off A1's leg and A recovers it, violation because A1 last to touch it in the FC.

You can answer your own questions by just examining the rule.

Rule 9,
SECTION 9 BACKCOURT
ART. 1 . . . A player shall not be the first to touch a ball after it has been in team control in the frontcourt, if he/she or a teammate last touched or was touched by the ball in the frontcourt before it went to the backcourt.

ART. 2 . . . While in team control in its backcourt, a player shall not cause the ball to go from backcourt to frontcourt and return to backcourt, without the ball touching a player in the frontcourt, such that he/she or a teammate is the first to touch it in the backcourt.

[williebfree]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

Ok- so the key is if B is the last to touch. A can touch it in the FC but as long as B touches it last before it goes back into the BC then it isn't a violation. kind of like the case book play, where on a looseball in A's fc b slaps it off A1's leg and A recovers it, violation because A1 last to touch it in the FC.

You're getting it!!!!

[mutantducky]

yippeee

[RookieDude]

I think the tough Team Control call, for some, is this scenario:

Team A, in their FC, attempts a try...the ball is momentarily controlled by post Player A1 after the missed shot.

Player B1 knocks the ball loose and there is a mad scramble for the loose ball, with both A1 and B1 hitting the ball at different times.

Finally, Player A1 undercuts Player B1 as they dive for the loose ball.

Team A has 10 team fouls.

Ruling: Team Control Foul...no foul shots for Player B1...ball at nearest point of the foul for a throw-in.

[mutantducky]

last snitch. well hopefully

If there is an inadvertent whistle for a BC violation in the examples I used, does ball go back to the original throw in spot? If the pass was controlled by team A1 or b. Pass not controlled. I guess you wouldn't put time back on the clock either

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

I think the tough Team Control call, for some, is this scenario:

Team A, in their FC, attempts a try...the ball is momentarily controlled by post Player A1 after the missed shot.

Player B1 knocks the ball loose and there is a mad scramble for the loose ball, with both A1 and B1 hitting the ball at different times.

Finally, Player A1 undercuts Player B1 as they dive for the loose ball.

Team A has 10 team fouls.

Ruling: Team Control Foul...no foul shots for Player B1...ball at nearest point of the foul for a throw-in.

This is no worse, in my opinion, than the official calling a 3-second violation on a player as the same mad scramble for the loose ball continues for four seconds out near the division line, but still in the front court.....But, the rules still say, the violation should be called in your scenario since team control has been established and the ball is in the front court.

[williebfree]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

Does anything change on this-

PART A: team A throws the ball in from the endline into their backcourt. Pass is caught controlled by A1 thus establishing control.

PART B: Ball is fumbled and tipped around into the frontcourt where it is again batted around by Team A or Team B. Ball then returns to the backcourt. Team A gets control of the ball- violation?
.

PART A: TEAM CONTROL EXISTS FOR TEAM A.

PART B: YES, IF TEAM A was LAST TO TOUCH in FC; NO if TEAM B was LAST TO TOUCH in FC

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

Does anything change on this-

So team A throws the ball in from the endline into their backcourt. Pass is caught controlled by A1 thus establishing control. Ball then is fumbled and tipped around. If a player from Team A OR Team B is the last to touch it in the backcourt and tips it into the frontcourt where it is again batted around by Team A or Team B. Ball goes into the backcourt. Team A gets control of the ball- violation?

I'm thinking yes it is a violation in either case. Even if team B touches it last(without control, loose ball) in the backcourt and again touches it again in the frontcourt, it would still be a violation if Team A gets the ball in the backcourt. So even if Team A did not touch the ball in the frontcourt they could still be called for a violation? That would be a really weird play.
If it is, do you call the violation right when Team A touches the ball in the backcourt after it had gone in the front or when they have control of the ball? Example, ball backcourt then frontcourt and then back, B1 knocks it off A1 while in the backcourt. Call it there?

4 Requirements:

1) Team Control
2) Ball obtains FC location
3) Team A last to touch before ball goes to BC
4) Team A first to touch after ball goes to BC

Apply those to your (or almost any) situation to get the answer.

3 Exceptions:

1) Jump ball
2) Throw In
3) Defensive Player