Finally I have seen one, first touch after....

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by mick

A2, chasing the ball, reached the ball and with his right hand batted the ball toward the frontcourt, and the ball landed on barely 1/2 of the division line and bounced into the frontcourt.

If the ball touched the division line, then the ball gained backcourt status. If it was touched by next A2, isn't this a backcourt violation? Sounds to me like this is similar to a player dribbling close to, and parallel to, the division line, the ball strikes the division line, and the dribbler, while in the frontcourt, continues to dribble. Isn't this also a backcourt violation?

[mick]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

If the ball touched the division line, then the ball gained backcourt status. If it was touched by next A2, isn't this a backcourt violation? Sounds to me like this is similar to a player dribbling close to, and parallel to, the division line, the ball strikes the division line, and the dribbler, while in the frontcourt, continues to dribble. Isn't this also a backcourt violation?

I think you are employing 9-1-1.

[mutantducky]

A player shall not be the first to touch a ball after it has been in team
control in the frontcourt, if he/she or a teammate last touched or was touched by


So if the ball is in control by A in the backcourt and on a pass the ball lands in the front court. The ball is then fumbled then tipped around. A is the last one to touch it and A2 recovers the ball in the bc. No violation because there hasn't been control?

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

A player shall not be the first to touch a ball after it has been in team
control in the frontcourt, if he/she or a teammate last touched or was touched by


So if the ball is in control by A in the backcourt and on a pass the ball lands in the front court. The ball is then fumbled then tipped around. A is the last one to touch it and A2 recovers the ball in the bc. No violation because there hasn't been control?

Not correct. Team A is in control the entire time. That's a backcourt violation.

[mutantducky]

? So the control in the backcourt carries over to control in the frontcourt? I guess the whole team that had control last remains in control during a loose ball situation.

What if, instead of a pass from the backcourt it is a throw in from the end/baseline. A1 touches the pass but there is no control and the ball is bouncing around and is tipped into the frontcourt and then by team A into the backcourt. Violation there? Does team control for team A start from the throw in?

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

? So the control in the backcourt carries over to control in the frontcourt? I guess the whole team that had control last remains in control during a loose ball situation.

What if, instead of a pass from the backcourt it is a throw in from the end/baseline. A1 touches the pass but there is no control and the ball is bouncing around and is tipped into the frontcourt and then by team A into the backcourt. Violation there? Does team control for team A start from the throw in?

I think that you've got it now. Team control does carry over until the ball becomes dead, the opponent gains control, or it is relinquished with a try for goal going into flight.

Since there is no team control during a throw-in, the situation that you have proposed with one tip/bat after another would not result in a backcourt violation.

BTW the NCAA ruling would be the same (no backcourt violation) even though there is team control during a throw-in as there is a specific exception for a throw-in written into the rules for that level.

[BillyMac]

During a throwin, even under a team’s own basket, if the throwin is deflected, tipped, or batted by an offensive player in the frontcourt to an offensive player in the backcourt; or after a missed field goal attempt or a missed foul shot attempt, if the ball is deflected, tipped, or batted by an offensive player in the frontcourt to an offensive player in the backcourt; these are not a backcourt violations. In both cases team control, a player holding or dribbling the ball, has not yet been established.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

? So the control in the backcourt carries over to control in the frontcourt?

The mistake here is to think that team control has a location. There is no "team control in the backcourt" or "team control in the frontcourt." Team control ends only in the ways Nevada describes.

Team control is one concept; ball and player location another. The backcourt violation rule links the two.

[mutantducky]

Does anything change on this-

So team A throws the ball in from the endline into their backcourt. Pass is caught controlled by A1 thus establishing control. Ball then is fumbled and tipped around. If a player from Team A OR Team B is the last to touch it in the backcourt and tips it into the frontcourt where it is again batted around by Team A or Team B. Ball goes into the backcourt. Team A gets control of the ball- violation?

I'm thinking yes it is a violation in either case. Even if team B touches it last(without control, loose ball) in the backcourt and again touches it again in the frontcourt, it would still be a violation if Team A gets the ball in the backcourt. So even if Team A did not touch the ball in the frontcourt they could still be called for a violation? That would be a really weird play.
If it is, do you call the violation right when Team A touches the ball in the backcourt after it had gone in the front or when they have control of the ball? Example, ball backcourt then frontcourt and then back, B1 knocks it off A1 while in the backcourt. Call it there?