legal or illegal dribble

[CoachP]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

And then I could come back and say case play 4.44.5 SitB says there is a difference between the two. A player on the floor is allowed to stand up, as long as they are dribbling, but they are not allowed to place the ball on the floor, then stand, then be the first to touch it again. So, doesn't that say "placing the ball on the floor" is not the same as "dribbling"? Two distinct acts (dribbling vs. placing) while doing the same thing (standing up), where one is legal and one is a violation.

(Oh, crap, here comes my headache again...)

And therein lies my headache.

A1 goes sliding across the floor to gather a loose ball. When he stops he can place it on the floor, stand, but not touch it again.

But if A1 runs across the floor, secures a loose ball, sets the ball on the floor; some here are saying, not only is he allowed to touch it, he can pick it up and dribble it??

[rockyroad]

Don't have my books here, and too lazy to walk out to the car on a Saturday morning - but doesn't the case play involving the player placing ball on floor, standing up, then picking up the ball say that the player has committed a traveling violation? If so, what does that have to do with this argument about illegal dribble???

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by CoachP

A1 goes sliding across the floor to gather a loose ball. When he stops he can place it on the floor, stand, but not touch it again.

This is specifically forbidden by the case play. 4.44.5 B

But if A1 runs across the floor, secures a loose ball, sets the ball on the floor; some here are saying, not only is he allowed to touch it, he can pick it up and dribble it??

This is not specifically forbidden by anything.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by CoachP

A1 goes sliding across the floor to gather a loose ball. When he stops he can place it on the floor, stand, but not touch it again.

But if A1 runs across the floor, secures a loose ball, sets the ball on the floor; some here are saying, not only is he allowed to touch it, he can pick it up and dribble it??

The real irony here is that the inconsistency you highlight is an example of the problem with your argument. The ruling on the sliding player scenario is an exception, and is completely inconsistent with the traveling ruling. Now you want to "solve the problem" by introducing another exception, this one completely inconsistent with the dribbling rule.

There is reasonable justification for the exceptional ruling on traveling, what is is the justification for an exception to the dribbling rule?

[CoachP]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

The real irony here is that the inconsistency you highlight is an example of the problem with your argument. The ruling on the sliding player scenario is an exception, and is completely inconsistent with the traveling ruling. Now you want to "solve the problem" by introducing another exception, this one completely inconsistent with the dribbling rule.

There is reasonable justification for the exceptional ruling on traveling, what is is the justification for an exception to the dribbling rule?

If it is an exception, then why was it used a few pages back to add proof that it is a dribble? Shouldn't an exception ONLY be used for it's specific case?
Can't have it both ways.....

As I said earlier, our local assignor calls it a dribble, (setting the ball down, wiping his socks, picking up again) but yet another referee I saw by chance Sunday (from another association) says it is a loose ball and he may pick up and dribble................

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by CoachP

If it is an exception, then why was it used a few pages back to add proof that it is a dribble? Shouldn't an exception ONLY be used for it's specific case?
Can't have it both ways.....

Yep.

Originally Posted by CoachP

As I said earlier, our local assignor calls it a dribble, (setting the ball down, wiping his socks, picking up again) but yet another referee I saw by chance Sunday (from another association) says it is a loose ball and he may pick up and dribble................

Thus we have 7 pages and 95+ responses on this one. The fact is, the rule book doesn't define this action to be anything at all.