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The Name Game (Shirley Ellis, 1964) ...
More names in the score book than there are players warming up due to injury, illness, etc.
Is it necessary to erase the extra names? 4-34-4: A team member is a member of bench personnel who is in uniform and is eligible to become a player. We were always taught that it was better to have more names in the book than those warming up rather than fewer names in the book than those warming up. Tonight, my partner, the referee, insisted that the extra names be erased. He was the referee, so I just let him do his thing. I've never had anyone insist on this before. Was he right, or wrong?
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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I would rather have more than fewer. If something happens and a kid has to play, at least he is in the book.
Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael Mick Chambers (1947-2010) |
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Inquiring Minds Want To Know ...
What if he's on the bench but not in uniform? What if he's not even at the site?
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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There is no justification for erasing names from the book. The coach can list all individuals he/she wants.
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Owner/Developer of RefTown.com Commissioner, Portland Basketball Officials Association |
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Who care if he/she is on the bench but not in uniform or if he/she is or is not at the site? Maybe the player is not expected to play until the second half or will not arrive at the site until half time. MTD, Sr.
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Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Trumbull Co. (Warren, Ohio) Bkb. Off. Assn. Wood Co. (Bowling Green, Ohio) Bkb. Off. Assn. Ohio Assn. of Basketball Officials International Assn. of Approved Bkb. Officials Ohio High School Athletic Association Toledo, Ohio |
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Background Information ...
https://forum.officiating.com/basket...tml#post946707
https://forum.officiating.com/basket...tml#post700909 https://forum.officiating.com/basket...tml#post406783
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael Mick Chambers (1947-2010) |
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Care Bears ...
The answer to your question depends on whether you believe my partner was right, or wrong, to erase the extra names.
Wrong? You shouldn't care. Right? You should care because (maybe) it's a rule that may be complicated by kids on the bench in uniform that can't play (injury, illness, discipline, grades, etc.), kids not in uniform on the bench, or kids not at the site at all, maybe on their way, maybe not. 4-34-4: A team member is a member of bench personnel who is in uniform and is eligible to become a player. To me personally, the more names the better, but something made my veteran partner have those names erased tonight. I'd like to know if he was right, or wrong, and why.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 11:48pm. |
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Maybe These Rules ...
Quote:
member who may participate and designate the five starting players at least 10 minutes before the scheduled starting time. 4-34-4: A team member is a member of bench personnel who is in uniform and is eligible to become a player. 4-34-2: Bench personnel are all individuals who are part of or affiliated with a team, including, but not limited to: substitutes, coaches, manager(s) and statistician(s). During an intermission, all team members are bench personnel for the purpose of penalizing unsporting behavior.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 11:14pm. |
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No one I work for cares who was dressed and when, just be in the book if you do play. And I have worked college games where we've T'd for players being entered into book after the game started and for an incorrect number.
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A-hole formerly known as BNR |
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The Intent And Purpose Of The Rules ...
... to create an atmosphere of sporting behavior and fair play ... Therefore, it is important to know the intent and purpose of a rule so that it may be intelligently applied in each play situation.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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Billy, we went through this a few years ago when IAABO issued a ruling that such names could not be in the book. If I recall correctly, it stated that if the team member was not present at the start of the game, then his name could not be placed in the book at that time and would have to be added later upon his arrival creating a technical foul.
I didn't agree with it then and don't now. |
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Injured Kid Not In Uniform On The Bench ...
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IAABO Refresher Exam 2005: Question 73. Squad member #45 missed the bus and is not present at the time the squad list and starting lineup must be submitted for team members. During the pregame warmup, the referee counts eleven team members of team A but while checking the book team A has twelve team members listed. Referee informs the coach that the squad member who is not present may not be placed in the book even if he/she will get to the game late. Is the referee correct? Answer: Yes Rule Citation: Rule 3, Section 2, Article 1; Rule 4, Section 34, Article 4 I know that IAABO isn't the official interpreter of NFHS rules, but is the interpretation based on existing NFHS rules, independent of IAABO, maybe not in the case above, but maybe with a injured kid not in uniform on the bench (this is the kid whose name my partner had erased)? 3-2-1: At least 10 minutes before the scheduled starting time, each team shall supply the official scorer with the name and number of each team member and designate the five starting players. Failure to comply results in a technical foul (see 10-1-1 Penalty). So, who's a team member? 4-34-4: A team member is a member of bench personnel who is in uniform and is eligible to become a player.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Jan 25, 2016 at 11:49pm. |
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And I do not care because there is nothing in the rule that requires the people sitting on the bench to be accounted for. The only way I would even think to care is if I am working the State Finals and they want us to verify this information as they have a limit as to who can be on the bench, but that is beyond my pay grade. Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael Mick Chambers (1947-2010) |
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