Marty Foster's call at 3rd base today

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

"go out and argue"

You go, Earl Weaver.

Yeah, it's really heartwarming to have umpires go out and argue when they become coaches. Umpires should know better than that. Coaches that umpire are not umpires that also coach, I suppose.

[JFlores]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Yeah, it's really heartwarming to have umpires go out and argue when they become coaches. Umpires should know better than that. Coaches that umpire are not umpires that also coach, I suppose.

Ok maybe I should of said discuss in a friendly manner.
So what you guys are trying to tell me is that I should not go and discuss a call that I feel he had a bad angle on or better yet I should not pick on the plate umpire that has no ball bags. I get it!

Come on guys, its not doing me a disservice when a call gets screwed, its the kids that get screwed and upset. Its upto the coaches to handle said situations.
We are all in this to get the call right.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JFlores

Ok maybe I should of said discuss in a friendly manner.
So what you guys are trying to tell me is that I should not go and discuss a call that I feel he had a bad angle on or better yet I should not pick on the plate umpire that has no ball bags. I get it!

Come on guys, its not doing me a disservice when a call gets screwed, its the kids that get screwed and upset. Its upto the coaches to handle said situations.
We are all in this to get the call right.

How many times does an umpire change a judgment call?

If you came out and told me I had a bad angle or how I should umpire, you'd find yourself quickly ejected. I won't tell you how to coach, don't tell me how to umpire.

And it's none of a coach's business how the plate guy handles the spare baseballs, really. Sure, the guy is probably a complete Smitty, but making an *** of yourself sure isn't going to make things better. Just get you run and look like a jerk.

[Kevin Finnerty]

I coached plenty of travel ball, league ball, scout ball and I've assisted in JUCO ball, and I have never gone out and argued with an umpire, and if I ever did have a grievance, it was part of a sideline conversation later in the game. And that includes years ago before I became an umpire.

In fact, when an umpire, who currently coaches, comes out and "argues" or "discusses" a call, respect for his status as an umpire is diminished in the eyes of the umpire. I think Rich articulated that pretty well.

[JFlores]

Touchy subject ehhh. Too sensitive I see, its about getting the call right in the end.

So next time I will just sit in the dugout and let the men in blue stick it to my team up the a$$. I never argued ball and strikes, but all I was asking for was an appeal.

I guess its one of those you have to be there moments. Or should I just play a mute and blind?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JFlores

Touchy subject ehhh. Too sensitive I see, its about getting the call right in the end.

So next time I will just sit in the dugout and let the men in blue stick it to my team up the a$$. I never argued ball and strikes, but all I was asking for was an appeal.

I guess its one of those you have to be there moments. Or should I just play a mute and blind?

An appeal? Missed base, check swing or leaving early on a caught fly ball? Cause those are the only appeals umpires recognize.

[JFlores]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

An appeal? Missed base, check swing or leaving early on a caught fly ball? Cause those are the only appeals umpires recognize.

That is the one, where I blew my roof. Anyways it was one of those you had to be there to understand my view or grief. Sorry I wont vent anymore.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JFlores

That is the one, where I blew my roof. Anyways it was one of those you had to be there to understand my view or grief. Sorry I wont vent anymore.

No, I can imagine. Don't think I'm completely unsympathetic. I just don't think you come off well when you say things like you did above.

I'm not sure I can be a coach. I watch umpires not even look at the touch of first base when observing other crews. If I was the coach, I would appeal every time I saw the BU not turn his head and probably get run when I asked how he knew when he didn't even look.

[JJ]

Before you go out to "argue" or "discuss", consider who you are going out to "argue" or "discuss" with. A very simple "You missed that one" should suffice in most cases - and not yelled from across the field. It doesn't sound like that umpire was very experienced, which indicates maybe the league isn't a high level league that hires very experienced officials. Players, coaches and umpires are all learning in this type of league. Sounds like your players are learning that it's OK to "blow your top" at umpires, and it sounds like that umpire is learning that you're a coach with a short fuse.
When you umpire, don't coach, and vice versa. If that means biting your tongue when you coach, that's the price you pay as an umpire who coaches.

We're delighted you coach so the kids can play. Be delighted we umpire so they can play as well, no matter how inexperienced we are and whether or not we measure up to your expectations.

Whew....touchy/feely...not where I usually come from....

JJ

[DonInKansas]

Originally Posted by JFlores

That is the one, where I blew my roof.

When has a coach "blowing his roof" ever gotten him anything but ejected?

[Kevin Finnerty]

Originally Posted by JFlores

Touchy subject ehhh. Too sensitive I see, its about getting the call right in the end.

So next time I will just sit in the dugout and let the men in blue stick it to my team up the a$$. I never argued ball and strikes, but all I was asking for was an appeal.

I guess its one of those you have to be there moments. Or should I just play a mute and blind?

Well, first of all, you're originally from Brooklyn. So you're naturally going to be more argumentative and harder to reach with a point of view. But now that you're from Texas, I'm sure you'll mellow out in due time.

[cc6]

Originally Posted by Kevin Finnerty

In fact, when an umpire, who currently coaches, comes out and "argues" or "discusses" a call, respect for his status as an umpire is diminished in the eyes of the umpire. I think Rich articulated that pretty well.

Why do you believe a coach's status as an umpire decreases when he argues a call? Does he not have to right to discuss in a reasonable tone? Work with one's partner when umpiring, work with the umpires when coaching, and there shouldn't be an issue.

[jicecone]

Originally Posted by JFlores

Ok maybe I should of said discuss in a friendly manner.
Come on guys, its not doing me a disservice when a call gets screwed, its the kids that get screwed and upset. Its upto the coaches to handle said situations.
We are all in this to get the call right.

Sorry, when I coached I was in it to teach the kids the game of baseball, self discipline and repect for the game, their teammates, oppoents, coaches and officials.

I explained to them that playing ball was no different then life. You give your all and if that wasn't good enough or something didn't go your way, then you got to work harder next time.

I sat kids down for disrespecting other players, coaches and officials. If I had a question about a call that is exactly what it was. Can you explain to me the call please? Thanks. You can't want to win the game for the players more than them and you can't play it for them.

And that is EXACTLY what it is, A GAME.

So the next time you think that an umpire or any official shows up a a game you are coaching in, just to screw the kids , then try and lead by example, handle the situation without complaining. (America's favorite past time) You have an oppurtunity to show them how to be one step above the rest, so take it.

And that is how real coaches, "handle said situations" when leading kids.

[JFlores]

Originally Posted by jicecone

Sorry, when I coached I was in it to teach the kids the game of baseball, self discipline and repect for the game, their teammates, oppoents, coaches and officials.

I explained to them that playing ball was no different then life. You give your all and if that wasn't good enough or something didn't go your way, then you got to work harder next time.

I sat kids down for disrespecting other players, coaches and officials. If I had a question about a call that is exactly what it was. Can you explain to me the call please? Thanks. You can't want to win the game for the players more than them and you can't play it for them.

And that is EXACTLY what it is, A GAME.

So the next time you think that an umpire or any official shows up a a game you are coaching in, just to screw the kids , then try and lead by example, handle the situation without complaining. (America's favorite past time) You have an oppurtunity to show them how to be one step above the rest, so take it.

And that is how real coaches, "handle said situations" when leading kids.

The bolded part is false, I don't ever think an umpire shows up to screw a kid. I tell my players never to argue or disagree with the umpires, that it is my job.

An umpire can never cost us a game, I truly believe that and preach it, but I expect to be heard when I have a question on a play.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by JFlores

The bolded part is false, I don't ever think an umpire shows up to screw a kid. I tell my players never to argue or disagree with the umpires, that it is my job.

An umpire can never cost us a game, I truly believe that and preach it, but I expect to be heard when I have a question on a play.

Let's put it this way then: You did say that the umpire's bad call screwed the kids. This is false. The call cost one of many opportunities you had to win the game. The umpire didn't have anything to do with the 5 errors made and/or the 4 HRs your team gave up that really led to your team losing. The kids wouldn't care so much if you didn't make a big deal out of it by losing your cool with the umpire. They don't see it as getting screwed by the umpire without you planting that idea in their heads.