Obstruction and timing play

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by PSUchem

Situation:

ASA 14U girls' fastpitch

2 outs. R3 on 2B. B4 hits a hard shot to left center. R3 is obstructed by F6, who was playing in the baseline. I have R3 protected to home, as she would have scored easily on the hit without the obstruction. B4, as 14 yr old girls do, hesitates before trying to stretch hit into a double. B4 is tagged out at 2B.

Now, in our situation, the runner DID cross the plate ahead of the tag out at 2B, but just barely due to the obstruction.

Question: Since R3's award would be home, would the award still allow the run to score if the runner had not crossed home before the 3rd out was made due to the obstruction? Basically I am asking if the award supersedes the timing play. Is the runner allowed to finish her "baserunning duties" after the 3rd out?

My other thought was that the "subsequent play" might have come into effect, thus nullifying the obstruction, but the runner had not reached the bag to which she was protected.

Thanks all!

Not that it would be commonplace for it to be an issue, but you would score the run if you judged the OBS runner would have scored prior to the put out on the bases absent the OBS.

I don't think that would happen often, if ever, but I guess it would be possible so to avoid the TWP argument, that is probably how it should be presented in an explanation.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Not that it would be commonplace for it to be an issue, but you would score the run if you judged the OBS runner would have scored prior to the put out on the bases absent the OBS.

I don't think that would happen often, if ever, but I guess it would be possible so to avoid the TWP argument, that is probably how it should be presented in an explanation.

At the time of the obstruction, the OP judged the obstructed runner would easily score. This is an awarded base that would be scored regardless of any timing play, it seems to me.

The put out of the runner at 2B is due to a poor baserunning decision... either trying to stretch a single into a double, or hesitating on a double and getting put out. Neither has anything to do with the obstruction, so the base is awarded and the run scores.

Is my reasoning incorrect?

[MD Longhorn]

I believe I've only seen it once, and it was more dramatic. I was observing, and they got it right in my opinion, and managed not to eject anyone, as the scored run tied the game in a semi-final, and they had BOTH coaches out there (PU arguing with DC, BU arguing with OC on the play at 2nd base)

R2 and F6 both watching the 2-out hit into right field and collide dramatically, both going down and staying down. R1 scores easily. BR thrown out at 2nd (no hesitation on her part - just thrown out on a close play). PU ruled (properly imho) that R2 would have scored. Which makes sense after the fact considering R2 had a lead, and BR did not ... and the play ended up very close.

[chapmaja]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I believe I've only seen it once, and it was more dramatic. I was observing, and they got it right in my opinion, and managed not to eject anyone, as the scored run tied the game in a semi-final, and they had BOTH coaches out there (PU arguing with DC, BU arguing with OC on the play at 2nd base)

R2 and F6 both watching the 2-out hit into right field and collide dramatically, both going down and staying down. R1 scores easily. BR thrown out at 2nd (no hesitation on her part - just thrown out on a close play). PU ruled (properly imho) that R2 would have scored. Which makes sense after the fact considering R2 had a lead, and BR did not ... and the play ended up very close.

That is a really tough call to make, and one that takes some to make. So many factors come into play on a situation like that. The speed of the runners is just one situation to consider. I would say that unless the runner was really slow and lumbering she likely would have scored.

It's funny to see both coaches out on the field arguing calls on the same play. I've only seen that once, and it was because I kicked a call initially IMO, which set off a strange set of circumstance. In a 1 umpire system you just have to have the coaches wait in line to argue I guess.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by chapmaja

That is a really tough call to make, and one that takes some to make.

We all agreed that PU had some serious stones that day.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dakota

At the time of the obstruction, the OP judged the obstructed runner would easily score. This is an awarded base that would be scored regardless of any timing play, it seems to me.

The put out of the runner at 2B is due to a poor baserunning decision... either trying to stretch a single into a double, or hesitating on a double and getting put out. Neither has anything to do with the obstruction, so the base is awarded and the run scores.

Is my reasoning incorrect?

Actually, much more than I would have thought. AFA the award, the only thing I considered is if the OBS runner would have scored prior to the put out without the OBS. Really don't care why or how the other runner was put out, that is irrelevant to the rule other than the fact it was the 3rd out.