Dallas v. Washington

[MD Longhorn]

Anyone have opinions on the USC called on Dallas late in the 4th quarter last night, where a still standing Redskin receiver who had caught the ball was hit in the shoulder by the defender (and with the defender's shoulder). I know they are to be very careful with head contact and defenseless receivers, and I thought I even heard WH say the word defenseless receiver...

Is there any case where a receiver who has CAUGHT THE BALL and is not yet tackled might be considered a defenseless receiver?

Any other reason anyone can think of that this was flagged (by TWO officials, no less)? I replayed it a few times and cannot see what they thought they saw. Heck, it was not even that good of a hit, and he had a better chance of hurting his TEAMMATE than the receiver.

[mbyron]

Got the video, Mike?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Got the video, Mike?

Looking right now, actually.

[bigjohn]

How about this no call?

Laron Landry's Big Hit on Laurent Robinson (MNF 9-26-11) - YouTube

[Rich]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

How about this no call?

Laron Landry's Big Hit on Laurent Robinson (MNF 9-26-11) - YouTube

Looks good to me, at any level.

[zm1283]

I didn't think it warranted an USC penalty. The defender hit the receiver in the chest with his shoulder. I don't know exactly what the NFL is looking for on these types of plays, it just seems it's getting a little out of hand when you can't hit someone with your shoulder and there is zero helmet-to-helmet contact.

[oncelost77]

Did Landry lead with his helmet and make contact with his helmet first? I think so. I don't like the walk over the top of him after getting up either but that seems common place in the NFL these days. High school and college I would call it in a second, wouldn't hesitate.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by oncelost77

Did Landry lead with his helmet and make contact with his helmet first? I think so. I don't like the walk over the top of him after getting up either but that seems common place in the NFL these days. High school and college I would call it in a second, wouldn't hesitate.

No, he didn't. Shoulder hit.

[InsideTheStripe]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

How about this no call?

Laron Landry's Big Hit on Laurent Robinson (MNF 9-26-11) - YouTube

Good no call.

[oncelost77]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

No, he didn't. Shoulder hit.

I paused it at :26 where he dips his head to prepare for contact. Again at :31, it seems that his helmet hits first. Guess I would have flagged it in a game and video review would have supported the call enough for me to not lose sleep.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by oncelost77

Did Landry lead with his helmet and make contact with his helmet first? I think so.

In the last view in slow motion, he did flex his neck and lower his head just before contact. I would never have seen that full speed, so I could never have called it, but it is the rxn we don't want players to have to impending contact.

[bigjohn]

Looks like IHC to me, too!

LOL!!

[oncelost77]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

In the last view in slow motion, he did flex his neck and lower his head just before contact. I would never have seen that full speed, so I could never have called it, but it is the rxn we don't want players to have to impending contact.

I agree that full speed makes it very difficult but anytime that head dips my hand goes to the flag and I let it process. If my hand ever goes to my flag, I normally throw it on plays like this. KCI, Spearing, Horse Collar, etc... I default to protecting the players. If we saw more flags for leading with the helmet/dipping the helmet, including against the ball carrier, we would probably see less plays like this. Ever since we put an emphasis on the horse collar tackle, I have seen the number of those offenses go down.

.02

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Looks good to me, at any level.

Agree, and I would say it's clearly legal (not borderline).

Those of you who think this play is IHC seem not to know what "initiating contact with the helmet" means or how this foul is to be called. The tackler led with his shoulder, and even if the helmet arrives a microsecond earlier it's not a foul.

To be a foul, the IHC must be obvious, not borderline. To be obvious, it must involve no or minimal contact with the shoulder.

[APG]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Agree, and I would say it's clearly legal (not borderline).

I agree wholeheartdly...the Landry hit was clearly legal.

NFL Rules Book (2011)

Rule 12, Section 2, Article 9

(b) Prohibited contact against a player who is in a defenseless posture is:

(1) Forcibly hitting the defenseless player’s head or neck area with the helmet, facemask, forearm, or shoulder, regardless of whether the defensive player also uses his arms to tackle the defenseless player by encircling or grasping him; and

(2) Lowering the head and making forcible contact with the top/crown or forehead/”hairline” parts of the helmet against any part of the defenseless player’s body.

Note: The provisions of (2) do not prohibit incidental contact by the mask or helmet in the course of a conventional tackle on an opponent