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You were correct on the penalty and the enforcement. The enforcement spot is the end of the run which is also the spot of the foul. However, had A fumbled the ball then it is a loose ball play and the spot of enforcement is the previous spot.
Under NFHS rules grabbing a player by any helmet opening or the chin strap is the same as if the opposing player had grabbed the facemask. |
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No, it would be previous spot because the face mask is considered to have happened during a loose ball play. Remember on a loose ball play, all action prior to it becoming a loose ball play is considered to be a part of the play. Same thing if you were to have something like defensive holding on a receiver before a forward pass is thrown.
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Even if you’re on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there. - Will Rogers |
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![]() Seriously, how can I wrap my mind around this rule? It gives me fits every time I think about it. Would I be correct in saying that if the foul happened before or during a loose ball, then previous spot, but if the foul happened after the loose ball, then end of run? I'm thoroughly confused. ![]() |
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p.s. - thanks to all for the help with the loose ball. now maybe i can report the foul AND give spot/down/distance. ![]() |
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Go ahead, start. This is bad thinking. Everyone on the field is responsible for knowing penalty enforcement.
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I got a fever! And the only prescription.. is more cowbell! |
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I prefer 2 wings and an R 3-man, so that's what we did. I was the Referpire. On a dead ball personal foul that I flagged (on the offense), the play had already reached the LTG. Because I knew I had to signal and also march off the yardage, I hurried and didn't (at first) notice the chains. My L called across and made me aware and as soon as I saw the chains knew why he was calling across. Rules mistakes are crew mistakes. All 5 officials (or 3 or 4) should know enforcements of every flag they could possibly throw (which means they should know the rules as well as I do). And I hate to admit it, I had fun working 3-man as I got a good workout (although I'm sure things were missed in the middle, which on a Saturday JV game isn't the worst thing in the world). |
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I admit, I was being a bit facetious in my previous post - I do try to know, understand, and enforce all the rules. I work JV games as WH, and have never seemed to have a problem when it comes to enforcing the flags thrown, but when I sit down and think about this rule, I still get confused. Maybe it's one of those things you just do as a matter of habit and instinct. Although I do wonder if I've done it wrong in the past, and nobody, including me, caught it.!?
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I got a fever! And the only prescription.. is more cowbell! |
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One helpful thing to remember is that a down can have at most ONE loose ball play, namely the last one. All action prior to that last loose ball is treated as part of the loose ball play. So if you have a pass followed by a fumble followed by a backward pass, it's all one big loose ball play until the last loose ball is caught or recovered. The basic spot for a foul during any of that action would be the previous spot. A down can comprise any number of running plays, each of which has its own basic spot (the end of that run). That's why when a runner fumbles beyond the LOS, we mark the end of the run with a beanbag. That's our basic spot for fouls that occurred during that run. If the foul occurs when the ball is loose, then we're back to a loose ball play with a different basic spot.
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Cheers, mb |
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It's considered a running play if the fumble is beyond the line of scrimmage -- the basic spot is then the end of the associated run. I know this is confusing if you're not used to enforcing these. There's a great breakdown of this in the Redding Guide, BTW. Best money you'll ever spend -- I bought 5 of them this year, one for each member of my crew. Last edited by Rich; Wed Sep 08, 2010 at 08:54am. |
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Here in Ohio, our mechanics czar has directed us to bag all fumbles, including those behind the NZ. The rationale is to instill the habit of bagging fumbles.
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Cheers, mb |
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