Wisconsin-Arizona Player Control Foul (Video)

[tomegun]

I looked at the video, looked up the definition of lateral (just to make sure I'm not crazy), looked at the video again and asked my wife to look at the video. If someone can move laterally while their body is moving in the direction they are facing, and they take one step in that direction prior to contact, then yes I agree the player was moving laterally.

This play could make the NCAA video for next season. Tough play in a tough situation.

I purposely didn't mention the official or past accomplishments as that has no bearing on a discussion about the call to me.

[APG]

I've got a foul on the defender for moving forward into the dribbler prior to the push off by the dribbler.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by APG

I've got a foul on the defender for moving forward into the dribbler prior to the push off by the dribbler.

So do I for the same reason. I see W21 moving into F13 before the push by F13.

I also have continuation on the play.

Originally Posted by tomegun

I purposely didn't mention the official or past accomplishments as that has no bearing on a discussion about the call to me.

Agreed.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by APG

I've got a foul on the defender for moving forward into the dribbler prior to the push off by the dribbler.

Agreed. Like the Michigan St. game, the big push off was retaliation for the initial contact.

[canuckrefguy]

The ONLY point at which there is contact between the two players:







If the dribbler continues on his path without pushing off, there is no question of a defensive foul and continuation. The problem is he doesn't do that. He pushes off BEFORE there is any illegal contact by the defender.

It's a bang-bang play, and as close as it gets - but I still like the offensive foul call - whether it's Tony Greene, APG, or even TCW calling it

[Rich]

Originally Posted by twocentsworth

Watch the video of that play - even Ray Charles. An see Tony Greene running right past Coach Williams. The REAL problem is that Tony AND his partners didn't look at the UNC bench immediately after ISU scored. How can you possibly advance to the NCAA tournament as an official and NOT have game awareness that instinctively causes u to look at the bench immediately after a last second basket. It's so simple!!! It's unbelievable that not only didn't he look...HE RAN RIGHT PAST A COACH WHO SIGNALED AND CALLED FOR IT....

You've come back to the forum for the expressed purpose of ripping an official working the tourney in a personal way. Either knock it off...or go away.

[tomegun]

Canuck, that isn't contact in the first pic? From the first pic to the second it looks like the defender moves laterally; this is after he moves forward into the offensive player.

I can't focus...why would a boxer lick another boxer's chest during a weigh in?

[canuckrefguy]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Canuck, that isn't contact in the first pic? From the first pic to the second it looks like the defender moves laterally; this is after he moves forward into the offensive player.

That was my point - the defender hadn't actually knocked him off course. Before that can happen, dribbler pushes off (image 2). If he just continues on his path, he's going to the line, maybe for an and-one.

Like I said, bang/bang play. But I still think the right call. By the closest of margins.

[blindzebra]

Block happened first.

The defender was draped over the offensive player to the point his arm pit was touching his head.

[Johnny Ringo]

This seems to be a coin toss amongst officials. For me, the coin lands on "I like the call" that was made.

I think this is an ant/elephant play. The ant is the illegal contact by the defender. The elephant is the push-off by the offensive player.

[APG]

Originally Posted by AremRed

I think this is an ant/elephant play. The ant is the illegal contact by the defender. The elephant is the push-off by the offensive player.

The whole reason the guy is pushing off is cause a defender is running into him.

[Camron Rust]

My take...defender wasn't exactly legal, BUT that contact was marginal at best, not worthy of a call. The push off was more than marginal. Good call.

Originally Posted by fortmoney

to accuse him of purposely ignoring a timeout request - who would do that?

twocentsworth said no such thing. He never explicitly stated, nor did he imply that Tony Green purposely ignored a timeout request. Let's take a quick look at what twocentsworth did say, just so we are clear:

"Tony Greene is the official who ran directly I front of Roy Williams who was signaling and yelling for a timeout"

Verdict: FACTUAL. That actually happened. Tony Greene ran in front of Roy Williams who was signalling and yelling for a timeout. Not sure how this implies Greene purposely ignored Williams.

"....AND DID NOTHING."

Verdict: FACTUAL. Tony Greene did nothing. That also actually happened. He didn't realize Williams was calling a timeout until it was too late. Still not sure how this implies Greene purposefully ignored the timeout request.

"Simply put, Tony has not had a season worthy of a Final Four assignment (or Elite Eight, for that matter)."

Verdict: Opinion. twocentsworth is entitled to his opinion about the year Greene had, but this is still not an indication that Greene purposefully ignored a timeout request.

Originally Posted by fortmoney

I'm not sure what you have against Tony personally

From what I can see, twocentsworth doesn't have anything personal against Tony Greene. He made factual statements about what actually happened. It was you who introduced this "personal" spin.

Originally Posted by APG

The whole reason the guy is pushing off is cause a defender is running into him.

I see your point, but they are closing in on each other about equally. I see the initial contact as marginal and the push-off as illegal. I think the obvious call here is PC....while block could be correct as well, PC is more correct.