The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 02:22am
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,123
Jump ball-Held Ball (Video)



Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 02:36am
Show up, keep up, shut up
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,579
Wow! Rejump.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 05:23am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 12
Hey, all. First time posting. I just graduated from USC, and I'm getting certified to officiate high school games for the first time with the CBOA in October. Just thought I'd start participating, as this forum has proven to be a gold mine for someone like me looking to improve and get off on the right foot.

Anyway, I think the right call here is probably that the AP procedure was not yet established and this should be a rejump, but I think you could make the argument that Red had control of the ball before the held ball (the Red player might get both hands on the ball before or at the same time that White gets one hand on the ball), and thus it should be an AP throw-in for White.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 07:05am
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 14,481
I'm going with a re-jump.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 07:49am
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsavitzky View Post
Hey, all. First time posting. I just graduated from USC, and I'm getting certified to officiate high school games for the first time with the CBOA in October. Just thought I'd start participating, as this forum has proven to be a gold mine for someone like me looking to improve and get off on the right foot.

Anyway, I think the right call here is probably that the AP procedure was not yet established and this should be a rejump, but I think you could make the argument that Red had control of the ball before the held ball (the Red player might get both hands on the ball before or at the same time that White gets one hand on the ball), and thus it should be an AP throw-in for White.
If red had it first, it was by such a slim margin that you can't even tell for sure on video. Go with the a re-jump.

Now, here's the question for you since you're just getting started.

Who jumps?
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 07:58am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 280
If this happened in my game it would be a re-jump between Red #15 and White #30.

In my judgement there was no control prior to the held ball.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 08:10am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 17,720
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam View Post
If red had it first, it was by such a slim margin that you can't even tell for sure on video. Go with the a re-jump.

Now, here's the question for you since you're just getting started.

Who jumps?
Damn. That's what I was going to ask. Hint: It might depend on the rules code.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 08:17am
This IS My Social Life
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: at L, T, or C
Posts: 2,379
Right On

Quote:
Originally Posted by BEAREF View Post
If this happened in my game it would be a re-jump between Red #15 and White #30. In my judgement there was no control prior to the held ball.
Correct assessment of the proper ruling!

Just one side note rant...
I truly detest hearing that phrase "in my game...". That phrase I've too often heard around our area to egocentrically justify calling/no-calling something contrary to clearly established rule, procedure or protocol. As if "my game" carries some exceptional weight that out trumps what you "in your game" -- "if you dare be so stupid as to disagree with me and my disregard for an obvious rule".

"In my game, we don't call 'Carrying the Ball'". "In my game, we don't give charges when the collision occurs under the basket." "In my game, we don't call three seconds." "In my game we don't care what kind of accessories they're wearing." Blah, blah, blah.

However, "your game" would be marked by a correct application of 7-3-2 in the above sitch. As infrequently as it occurs, it is something to pregame so that when it happens the crew gets it right in "your game." Excellent analysis!
__________________
Making Every Effort to Be in the Right Place at the Right Time, Looking at the Right Thing to Make the Right Call

Last edited by Freddy; Fri Sep 06, 2013 at 09:56am.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 11:35am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam View Post
If red had it first, it was by such a slim margin that you can't even tell for sure on video. Go with the a re-jump.

Now, here's the question for you since you're just getting started.

Who jumps?
The rejump's between the two players involved in the held ball(didn't bother to watch the video again to see their numbers).
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 11:52am
#thereferee99
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 624
Red has two hands on the ball.

Can I imagine a scenario where I would grant a time out request to the red player? Yes.
Things occur quickly on the play, but red grabs the ball and then white ties him up.
__________________
-- #thereferee99
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 12:31pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,123
For the record I posted this for this kind of discussion.

But since I was one of the officials on this play, I clearly saw possession by the Red player first. Part of the discussion I had with my partner was asking if he had the same thing. He did so we went with a held ball and possession to white. It was not as clear on the video as I had a clear look at the Red player and how his hands were on the ball. Actually the White player as I remember it correctly only tied the ball up after the second attempt to grab the ball. The video does not confirm that as the ball is mostly hidden from the camera angle. And most of all, it was close and why we get paid the big bucks.

Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 01:01pm
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Jeff, that's a good point. The camera angle doesn't give us enough information on when red actually had control. But obviously the R has a great angle to see red's possession.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 01:42pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: West Orange, NJ
Posts: 2,583
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
For the record I posted this for this kind of discussion.

But since I was one of the officials on this play, I clearly saw possession by the Red player first. Part of the discussion I had with my partner was asking if he had the same thing. He did so we went with a held ball and possession to white. It was not as clear on the video as I had a clear look at the Red player and how his hands were on the ball. Actually the White player as I remember it correctly only tied the ball up after the second attempt to grab the ball. The video does not confirm that as the ball is mostly hidden from the camera angle. And most of all, it was close and why we get paid the big bucks.

Peace
I can see why you did it, even without a good angle on our end. It does appear Red secured the ball first.

Also saved you two from remembering who would've had to jump I hate rules like that which are different between the NFHS/NCAA codes. Makes me have to think out there which is a bad, bad thing.
__________________
"Everyone has a purpose in life, even if it's only to serve as a bad example."
"If Opportunity knocks and he's not home, Opportunity waits..."
"Don't you have to be stupid somewhere else?" "Not until 4."
"The NCAA created this mess, so let them live with it." (JRutledge)
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 01:43pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,123
The U1 had a great angle too, which is why we went with a held ball after possession. All I did was ask him, "Do you have possession by Red first then a held ball?" He said yes and we put the ball in play after discussing with the coach. Still close, but if he "no" to my question, I might have re-jumped the ball. It was not worth a fight and not so obvious that I would give my paycheck that night to hold onto an either/or judgment.

Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 06, 2013, 01:48pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,123
Quote:
Originally Posted by JetMetFan View Post
I can see why you did it, even without a good angle on our end. It does appear Red secured the ball first.

Also saved you two from remembering who would've had to jump I hate rules like that which are different between the NFHS/NCAA codes. Makes me have to think out there which is a bad, bad thing.
Forgive me I am a little bit in football mode now when it comes to rules differences. But what rules difference applies here that is difference between NF and NCAA? Sorry I would look it up but I am preparing my football pre-game for tonight's game.

Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Miami/Illinois held ball video request VTOfficial Basketball 8 Mon Mar 25, 2013 07:37am
Jump Ball play... video TussAgee11 Basketball 8 Sat Feb 20, 2010 03:01pm
Question -- Jump ball right after opening Jump ball bradfordwilkins Basketball 9 Tue Feb 22, 2005 03:42pm
held ball after initial jump Redhouse Basketball 9 Tue Feb 15, 2005 07:58am
Jump Ball: Possession Arrow vs. Actual Jump Ball KingTripleJump Basketball 21 Thu Feb 12, 2004 08:47am


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:28am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1