Another DVBOA play

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by OKREF

42 looks like he leans and sticks out his knee/leg. Block.

I just don't see that. At most, 42's feet are 12-16" apart. That is a pretty normal stance. I don't think he could have been positioned any more legally.

And regarding the push from behind that others have mentioned. I have nothing on that. Yes, it happened, but it was just a split second before the collision and had no effect on the play. The dribbler/driver was going to crash into the other two defenders with or without that extra nudge and that is the play to judge.

[JugglingReferee]

I also believe that 42's knee was outside his cylinder.

I do see the push that was mentioned by multiple previous posters. I wouldn't be surprised if that one is missed or even not called because it's effect was immaterial and minor in comparison to the knee-to-knee contact.

I'm leaning to the block rather than the PC. I don't think a no-call here is correct.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

I also believe that 42's knee was outside his cylinder.

I do see the push that was mentioned by multiple previous posters. I wouldn't be surprised if that one is missed or even not called because it's effect was immaterial and minor in comparison to the knee-to-knee contact.

I'm leaning to the block rather than the PC. I don't think a no-call here is correct.

Regardless of anything else, I agree with that.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I just don't see that. At most, 42's feet are 12-16" apart. That is a pretty normal stance. I don't think he could have been positioned any more legally.

And regarding the push from behind that others have mentioned. I have nothing on that. Yes, it happened, but it was just a split second before the collision and had no effect on the play. The dribbler/driver was going to crash into the other two defenders with or without that extra nudge and that is the play to judge.

I agree he does get there, I just see him move his right knee out to the right. I don't see a push at all. The trailing defender does get his arm out, but any contact happens after the crash. I also agree this isn't a pass.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I just don't see that. At most, 42's feet are 12-16" apart. That is a pretty normal stance. I don't think he could have been positioned any more legally.

And regarding the push from behind that others have mentioned. I have nothing on that. Yes, it happened, but it was just a split second before the collision and had no effect on the play. The dribbler/driver was going to crash into the other two defenders with or without that extra nudge and that is the play to judge.

I do disagree with officiating based on what will/may happen. The order of events are push then crash. Whether or not the ball handler was going to crash into the defenders is immaterial IMO.

[Rob1968]

I've watched this video several times, and can't rule the contact by the primary defender as a "push." Yes, he "finds" the ball-handler, but the contact of his right hand on the back of the ball-handler has no effect, as the offensive player is moving away from that minimal contact, and the action of the defender's arm/hand is quite relaxed.
At first look, the play seems to be a block on 42. Defender 33 seems to vacate his position, and has very little, if any contact on the ball-handler. From the camera angle, it's a 50-50 call, but trying to visualize the impact from a floor-level, the trailing official could better see the contact - high on the defender's right leg, continued sideways movement of the defender, etc.
All considered, I like a charge call. Also, the Lead seems fine with whatever the Trail called, as his demeanor after the call is totally relaxed.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by Rob1968

I've watched this video several times, and can't rule the contact by the primary defender as a "push." Yes, he "finds" the ball-handler, but the contact of his right hand on the back of the ball-handler has no effect, as the offensive player is moving away from that minimal contact, and the action of the defender's arm/hand is quite relaxed.

That's my take. If the defenders in the lane weren't there and the one behind did what he did I doubt I'd have a whistle since that arm, IMO, didn't affect RSBQ.

Originally Posted by Rob1968

Also, the Lead seems fine with whatever the Trail called, as his demeanor after the call is totally relaxed.

The L can "seem fine" with the call all he wants but there was an absolute train wreck in his PCA. He needs to have a whistle if only to show he's paying attention.

[Rob1968]

The L can "seem fine" with the call all he wants but there was an absolute train wreck in his PCA. He needs to have a whistle if only to show he's paying attention.[/QUOTE]

I agree that the L needed to be involved. My characterization of his demeanor was intended to bring the discussion to this point. I didn't see anything in the play that told me he was occupied with a match-up that didn't allow him to see the contact. Now, some assignors/evaluators want the T to stay with the play that originates in his area, all the way to the basket. Maybe the Lead was following that guideline, and would have had a whistle if the T had not made the call (?)