Louisiana Officials Possible Strike?

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Are you saying everyone is paid the same all over the state or a region?

Peace

The whole state

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

The whole state

And that seems to be the problem if you ask me.

Peace

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

And that seems to be the problem if you ask me.

Peace

And the solution is?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

And the solution is?

How about let conferences or school districts decide what the pay should be. You know like other sporting levels do.

Peace

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

And that seems to be the problem if you ask me.

Peace

And the problem is that when one group tries to grow a pair and stand up for themselves, the neighboring association comes swooping in to save the district from those nasty local officials.

It's the ultimate example of throwing your partner under the bus.

As for pay, here in CO there's a minimum that most schools just meet. There's nothing to prevent them from paying more, though. I would assume LA schools could likewise pay more than the state mandated peanuts.

[shavano]

Originally Posted by snaqwells

and the problem is that when one group tries to grow a pair and stand up for themselves, the neighboring association comes swooping in to save the district from those nasty local officials.

It's the ultimate example of throwing your partner under the bus.

+100.

[zm1283]

Our basketball association (Which books the vast majority of games for schools in this area of the state), contracts with individual schools to provide officials for their games. There is an agreed upon rate that the schools pay for each level of game, along with mileage. Our association allows us to schedule games on our own at any of the schools we service as long as they aren't varsity regular season games (Tournaments are okay as some schools book their own officials for their tournaments).

Some schools that are "in between" associations book their own officials for all games and decide on their own rates.

As far as contracts go, we use the Arbiter, but a small number of schools will send contracts as well for their games.

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

And the problem is that when one group tries to grow a pair and stand up for themselves, the neighboring association comes swooping in to save the district from those nasty local officials.

It's the ultimate example of throwing your partner under the bus.

.

SNAQ I disagree with you on this. This is what free market capitalism is all about. Just like anything else, people pay what the market will bear. If the schools can get away with paying so little, that is on the people accepting the games. Unless and until the associations get on the same page, this practice will continue and I have no problem with it.
Eventually, if enough officials say it isn't worth my time, then there will be a shortage of workers. In order to increase the pool of workers the "employers" will have to 'sweeten' the pot. IMO, I don't think the state officiating associations realize how much leverage they actually have. I agree that when the issue is 'revisited' if the compensation isn't up to snuff, then the associations should walk. If other Associations "poach" from those that walk away, it will be a short term fix. Eventually, they are going to run out of officials who think it is worth the drive and time to take these games.

Free market competition. It's a bit*** but it is the American way!!!
(Go rent F.I.S.T with Sylvester Stallone to get you fired up for the UNION!!)

[Adam]

I'm not saying they don't have a right to do it. I'm saying it's not "right." You say "until the associations get on the same page..." What do you think this is? It's undermining one another. I've got a problem with it.

AFAIC, the state association had a negotiated fix in place, and opted to punt instead. How many times would you like to revisit it?

Let me put it this way. How many warnings do we give a coach for poor behavior. They've been working on this since 2007. I'd say it's time to put on the adult pants, stand up, and blow the damned whistle.

I get FM competition, but those officials who are crossing the line are short sighted in that they're undermining the negotiating position of their brothers. Frankly, if that's what they want, then they can make $31 and ref forever at those rates.

[Judtech]

We agree with everything but the 'undermining thing'. That is why I said I think it is stupid and short sighted. I am certainly not calling SMART, but I really have no problem with them doing it. B/C Karma, and the Free Market, is a Bi***. Let's fast forward 13 months when NEXT season is over and these "poachers" have provided poor service and are facing an exodus of officials. NOW when the schools come back to the bargaining table, those that walked away will be in a GREATER position of strength, and those that "poached" will most likely NOT be forgotten by those other associations.
So, we agree on like 95% of the stuff.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Judtech

We agree with everything but the 'undermining thing'. That is why I said I think it is stupid and short sighted. I am certainly not calling SMART, but I really have no problem with them doing it. B/C Karma, and the Free Market, is a Bi***. Let's fast forward 13 months when NEXT season is over and these "poachers" have provided poor service and are facing an exodus of officials. NOW when the schools come back to the bargaining table, those that walked away will be in a GREATER position of strength, and those that "poached" will most likely NOT be forgotten by those other associations.
So, we agree on like 95% of the stuff.

Fair enough. I'm saying they shouldn't do it. You're saying they shouldn't do it but if they want to, so be it. Let them suffer the consequences later.

If that's what you're saying, I can't really argue with it.

Let me finish (for now) by saying you can bet I'd hold it against the poachers/scabs, too. My scratch list would grow, for one.

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I'm not saying they don't have a right to do it. I'm saying it's not "right." You say "until the associations get on the same page..." What do you think this is? It's undermining one another. I've got a problem with it.

AFAIC, the state association had a negotiated fix in place, and opted to punt instead. How many times would you like to revisit it?

Let me put it this way. How many warnings do we give a coach for poor behavior. They've been working on this since 2007. I'd say it's time to put on the adult pants, stand up, and blow the damned whistle.

I get FM competition, but those officials who are crossing the line are short sighted in that they're undermining the negotiating position of their brothers. Frankly, if that's what they want, then they can make $31 and ref forever at those rates.

+100

Those who are continually willing to work for peanuts are undermining the entire avocation IMO.

Then again, it's hardly surprising when you consider that, apparently, half of the officials in LA are still wearing belts.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Judtech

This is what free market capitalism is all about.

Since when are local officiating associations in competition with each other for schools? Offering lower fees? No travel fees?

Snaq is right. It's throwing your fellow officials under the bus. Here, the NCHSAA doesn't allow it. You get officials from the local association you're assigned to. We avoid such nonsense.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Since when are local officiating associations in competition with each other for schools? Offering lower fees? No travel fees?

Snaq is right. It's throwing your fellow officials under the bus. Here, the NCHSAA doesn't allow it. You get officials from the local association you're assigned to. We avoid such nonsense.

The only way there is competition is who is providing the best quality job, which obviously is in the eye of the beholder. Who goes where is decided to a large degree by geography, but, as far as I know, any school is free to use any association it chooses. Mileage is paid based on distance from the home of the association, not the actual mileage driven by the officials on any given night. So, game fees + mileage can still sometimes come out to be exactly the same for one school which changes from one association to another.
As far as Snaq's comment earlier about one group standing up for itself, I'm all for that but not when it leaves people in a lurch while breaking a previous agreement. I own a Mack truck. I haul mainly for myself, but occasionally for others. If I have been hauling for you for a hundred bucks a trip and decide I need more, I should call you to discuss terms, right in the middle of a load.

"Hey, boss. I'd like to keep hauling for you, but the next load is gonna cost a hundred and fifty. What? Too pricey? Fine, that's up to you, but in that case I'm just gonna dump this load on the side of the road."

Is this how one "stands up for oneself" in other parts of the world? Not here.

[just another ref]

It should be mentioned, if it hasn't already, that only 4 associations out of 14 were involved in this short-lived walkout. So who looks worse, the 4 that walked out, or the 10 that agreed to honor a previous commitment?