Louisiana Officials Possible Strike?

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

And as I read it, the officials were promised bi-yearly pay raises back in 2007 and none of those were ever implemented. Apparently the principals aren't too fond of following through on their promises also.

The time to bring that up would have been at the start of the year, or whenever the agreement which covers this year was reached, not now. JMO

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Not sure exactly what a "promise to revisit the pay raise" means, but I doubt if any of us will get health insurance and a company car now.

If the principals revisit the pay raise and vote it down again, it will just start all over.

And no official in LA will ever gain a decent and fair game fee imo, let alone health insurance and a company car, as long as there's other persons salivating in the wings just waiting to grab games from them at $36 a pop.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

If the principals revisit the pay raise and vote it down again, it will just start all over.

And no official in LA will ever gain a decent and fair game fee imo, let alone health insurance and a company car, as long as there's other persons salivating in the wings just waiting to grab games from them at $36 a pop.

That's not completely true. If those people in the wing can't call anywhere near as good of a game, the schools will realize they are getting what they are paying for and will pay for better officials. On the other hand, if there's no drop in the quality of officiating, it won't matter at all.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

By contract with the state interscholastic sports governing body, we get automatic raises every year equal to the average raise that teachers across the entire state get. This way we avoid the traditional labor problems that officials and schools got into every few years. No more deals worked out in smoke filled rooms. Here in the Land of Steady Habits, and the Land of Two Person Games: $88.28 for all varsity games. $57.25 for all subvarsity games (junior varsity, freshman, middle school). No mileage, it's a small state, and we pretty much stay in our own county.

This season, we got a 2% raise.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

I see. So the individual referees may be out of Dodge, but it certainly won't be "oh well" for the associations. They will face fines for lack of performance on their contractual obligations. This probably ends with all the current associations having to dissolve in order to not pay thousands of dollars in damages to the state association (or whoever they contract with).

My point is this is not a real strike (as a real strike involves a union and an employer) and the associations do not enjoy the protections the law provides to striking unions.

And if the state has not met it's contractual obligations in regards to a pay raise, sue them, but defaulting on your contract is always going to end up biting you in the butt.

THERE IS NO CONTRACT! We have the same system here as they do in LA. The officials association and the member schools are part of the state association. There is no contract between the schools, the officals or the association. It's simply in the bylaws of the state association that certified local associations will train and provide officials and are assigned to specific schools. Member schools will only use state certified officials. That's it, the end of it.

And if they choose not to work they can certainly do so. You can call it a strike, wlakout or whatever, but they certainly have the standing to do it. They are independent contractors. They work at their own pleasure and the pleasure of the schools. Schools must use LHSAA officials...at least until the emergency measure this week.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

If the principals revisit the pay raise and vote it down again, it will just start all over.

And it should. But hopefully the revisitation and ensuing debate will occur at the proper time.

And no official in LA will ever gain a decent and fair game fee imo, let alone health insurance and a company car, as long as there's other persons salivating in the wings just waiting to grab games from them at $36 a pop.

Salivating in the wings is hardly an accurate description.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by just another ref

And it should. But hopefully the revisitation and ensuing debate will occur at the proper time.

I don't think that we can necessarily say that this is the wrong timing. This is when the annucal convention is scheduled. We have no idea what may have occurred in previous conventions.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

THERE IS NO CONTRACT! We have the same system here as they do in LA. The officials association and the member schools are part of the state association. There is no contract between the schools, the officals or the association.

Once a game is assigned and accepted, I think there's a contract (but IANAL), even if there's no written document entitled "Contract."

So, it's unclear to me whether they are (or were) not working games that they had previously accpeted, or if they just weren't taking any new games.

[BillyMac]

Connecticut is an all IAABO state. All of our public high school, and Catholic high school, assigners are hired by the local IAABO boards. It is my understanding that the state board (overseeing all the local boards) signs a contract with the state interscholastic sports governing body every year.

For the past several years we have been having problems getting paid by the high schools in one of our largest cities. The excuse was always that the schools send the paperwork the Board of Education office, who then sends the paperwork to city hall, who then cuts the checks. The paperwork was always getting lost during this journey. It got really ridiculous two seasons ago, I finally got paid on July 14 for a game that I did before Christmas. I got paid because I was persistent, several phone calls, which always switched over to voice mail, and several emails, all of which were never responded to. I finally got my assignment commissioner, and secretary treasurer, involved, and that's how I finally got paid. Many probably never got paid, especially those who didn't keep accurate records, those that just go out to their mailbox, open up a check, and go to the bank to cash it. Others just gave up.

At several local board meetings we all complained that we needed to get their attention with some type of job action, like not working any more of their games. We were told that we couldn't because that would have been a breach of contract.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

I don't think that we can necessarily say that this is the wrong timing. This is when the annual convention is scheduled. We have no idea what may have occurred in previous conventions.

If next year's pay raise is voted down, and this is unacceptable, fine, just say "Good luck finding officials next year." Walking out at this point was not the thing to do, in my opinion.

Also, some say that the threat of the walkout is what caused some principals to vote against the pay raise who had previously intended to vote for it, before they heard this threat. Is this true, and how do these principals feel now? Who knows.

There is competition between associations. A couple of schools near my home told my assignor that if we would cover them through this, we would be rewarded with their business next season. The crossover turns out not to be necessary but I'm hopeful the switch, which had already been discussed, will still take place.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Once a game is assigned and accepted, I think there's a contract (but IANAL), even if there's no written document entitled "Contract."

So, it's unclear to me whether they are (or were) not working games that they had previously accpeted, or if they just weren't taking any new games.

It's a completely internal situation, with schools and officials both being part of the state association. It's like a dispute between Coke and Coke Zero.

As an LA official said earlier, associations are assigned to specific schools, that's pretty much the extent of a "contract." All I have to do is turn the game back in and I don't have to work it. If no one else is willing to work it, then the booking agent informs the school he doesn't have officials for the game.

At this point, it looks like they may have reached an agreement for most associations to go back to work.

LHSAA holds emergency meeting

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by just another ref

There is competition between associations.

We have this with spring, summer, and fall, AAU tournaments. There are a lot of "mini assigners" out there who only assign AAU tournaments, and each have their own little group of officials who work for them. AAU tournament organizers were trying to get the lowest fees possible by pitting the "mini assigners" against each other.

Our state IAABO board tried to get this all under the IAABO "umbrella", that is coming up with a standard fees statewide, and only allowing IAABO certified officials to work AAU games if the games were under this IAABO "umbrella". We made some headway, but not much due to the fact that officials are viewed as independent contractors, and some officials, and some AAU organizers, threatened to sue based on unfair labor practices, like restraint of trade. This scared our state IAABO board, so they backed off, and tabled it for another time.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by just another ref

There is competition between associations. A couple of schools near my home told my assignor that if we would cover them through this, we would be rewarded with their business next season.

Wow!

Nowayinhell can you call something like that "competition". That's nothing but freaking backstabbing. No wonder you guys are only getting $36/game if something like that is fairly prevalant. You're just screwing each other and in the end you're all paying for doing so.

No wonder the LHSAA has been getting away with underpaying for so many years.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Wow!

Nowayinhell can you call something like that "competition". That's nothing but freaking backstabbing. No wonder you guys are only getting $36/game if something like that is fairly prevalant. You're just screwing each other and in the end you're all paying for doing so.

No wonder the LHSAA has been getting away with underpaying for so many years.

I've seen this in other states. Associations poach schools from other associations. Miserable practice. I much prefer working as a true independent contractor and working whatever schools I want to work.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Wow!

Nowayinhell can you call something like that "competition". That's nothing but freaking backstabbing. No wonder you guys are only getting $36/game if something like that is fairly prevalant. You're just screwing each other and in the end you're all paying for doing so.

No wonder the LHSAA has been getting away with underpaying for so many years.

It's backstabbing to hire the people who would work when others wouldn't?
This was the principal's suggestion, not the assignors. Schools switch from one association to the other all the time. This is not due to being solicited, nor promised anything. (as far as I know) What I hear when a school switches is not that they switched because they like the new group, but that they disliked the old.

Question: Which officials do you like least/hate most?

Most common answer: The ones that called the last game we lost.