Whistle for a sub?

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Yes. The person without the ball handles subs and holds up the game until they're in / out. The person with the ball gets the thrower-in ready and waits for the subs to be completed.

If we're working 3-person and I'm the trail tableside administering a throw-in, the center opposite will get the subs.

Seriously - that's how all the people I work with here have done it.

Right, wrong, or indifferent, it's consistent.

This goes against common sense to me. If I'm about to put the ball in play beside the table and there are subs I'm not going to expect someone 45 feet away to call the subs in and possibly blow the whistle for the subs.

What if I call a non-shooting foul from the trail table side - with the spot table side - and there are subs waiting? I'm going to look right at the table, report, and then ignore the subs because my partner is bringing them in from the lead or center? I'm looking at the table and now my partner is looking at the table (two man) while nobody is focused on the players; it takes a split second for something bad to happen. Nah, whistle or not whistle, ball or no ball, the official closest to the table will handle the subs in Southern Nevada.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by tomegun

This goes against common sense to me. If I'm about to put the ball in play beside the table and there are subs I'm not going to expect someone 45 feet away to call the subs in and possibly blow the whistle for the subs.

What if I call a non-shooting foul from the trail table side - with the spot table side - and there are subs waiting? I'm going to look right at the table, report, and then ignore the subs because my partner is bringing them in from the lead or center? I'm looking at the table and now my partner is looking at the table (two man) while nobody is focused on the players; it takes a split second for something bad to happen. Nah, whistle or not whistle, ball or no ball, the official closest to the table will handle the subs in Southern Nevada.

I don't really see this as such a big deal. We all take a quick glance at the table. I can bring in subs from the C without taking my eyes off the court.

However, I have the current disadvantage of not having worked (with the exception of 2 camps) since March, so I'll have to think some more on this. I don't remember any confusion on sub situations, though, and I'm pretty sure we simply don't bring subs in when we have the ball. I'll have to talk to one of my regular partners about this tonight when we head to the Brewers game.

[JRutledge]

I am with Tommy on this issue. Not sure why if I am standing by the table with the ball I cannot notice the subs. But that does not mean I will not miss one or two depending on the situation. Then again if that is how you do it Rich then I can see how that is what you think is best. Just not something I would be used to.

Peace

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I don't really see this as such a big deal. We all take a quick glance at the table. I can bring in subs from the C without taking my eyes off the court.

However, I have the current disadvantage of not having worked (with the exception of 2 camps) since March, so I'll have to think some more on this. I don't remember any confusion on sub situations, though, and I'm pretty sure we simply don't bring subs in when we have the ball. I'll have to talk to one of my regular partners about this tonight when we head to the Brewers game.

I doubt there is confusion since that is what you are used to, but if the trail is beside the table with the ball and the lead (two man) is all the way on the end line across from the table, the lead has no choice but to look past/through other players to bring the sub in. Why the trail, who is right there, can't use a normal voice and say, "Come in sub" is beyond me. The ball will not be put into play because the trail has it anyway.

[tomegun]

Shifting gears slightly, how many (if any) single subs (one after the other) will you allow to come to the table and into the game during a dead ball before you make them wait? I'm talking about a coach sending A1, then the other coach B1, then A2, then B2 OR A1, A2, A3....

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Shifting gears slightly, how many (if any) single subs (one after the other) will you allow to come to the table and into the game during a dead ball before you make them wait? I'm talking about a coach sending A1, then the other coach B1, then A2, then B2 OR A1, A2, A3....

This is a game managment issue. I like to tell the coaches during our meet and greet - "Have your players ready at the table. I don't want an ongoing parade."

I don't have a set rule, but put a stop to it fast.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Shifting gears slightly, how many (if any) single subs (one after the other) will you allow to come to the table and into the game during a dead ball before you make them wait? I'm talking about a coach sending A1, then the other coach B1, then A2, then B2 OR A1, A2, A3....

More tolerant than I used to be, although I'll whistle the subsequent subs in well before they reach the table to minimize the delay.

[Mark Padgett]

I usually yell "SUB". If after the second yell they don't come in, I'll yell "HEY - I'M NOT ORDERING A SANDWICH HERE". That usually gets their attention.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Shifting gears slightly, how many (if any) single subs (one after the other) will you allow to come to the table and into the game during a dead ball before you make them wait? I'm talking about a coach sending A1, then the other coach B1, then A2, then B2 OR A1, A2, A3....

I've never gotten to the point where I deny a sub. But I do hate it when coaches do that.

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Shifting gears slightly, how many (if any) single subs (one after the other) will you allow to come to the table and into the game during a dead ball before you make them wait? I'm talking about a coach sending A1, then the other coach B1, then A2, then B2 OR A1, A2, A3....

In cases like these I usually make a comment loud enough for the coaches to hear, and it usually works. Something along the lines of "Anyone else you want to send in or can those of us on the floor start the game again?" "Anyone else? The water's fine"

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by Judtech

In cases like these I usually make a comment loud enough for the coaches to hear, and it usually works. Something along the lines of "Anyone else you want to send in or can those of us on the floor start the game again?" "Anyone else? The water's fine"

Are you kidding or do you really say that? I'm very much against "One Liners" and comments like this that can make a situation worse. What if someone talked to you like that? I wouldn't continue to have sporting behavior very long.

[tref]

+1

If we make comments like that, then kick a play later, its not gonna be pretty.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Are you kidding or do you really say that? I'm very much against "One Liners" and comments like this that can make a situation worse. What if someone talked to you like that? I wouldn't continue to have sporting behavior very long.

+1

Terrible advice. Nothing positive ever comes out of wiseazz responses.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

+1

Terrible advice. Nothing positive ever comes out of wiseazz responses.

Am I the only one that noticed the extreme irony in this response?

As a general rule, I would agree wiseazz responses, and perhaps profanity, should definitely be avoided. However, a lot depends on the specific official, and the "audience". There are a few officials that can get away with those types of responses, in limited situations. I actually heard an "old-timer" in our area reply to a coach's (somewhat dumb) question: "What the f*ck are you talking about?" I could tell from the look on the coach's face that he realized he asked a dumb question, walked away, and nothing was said after that. There's no way I could ever get away with saying that, but that's not my personality.

I think everyone here knows Mark Padgett's sense of humor - I'm sure he really does use a number of those lines during some of his games. But he also knows his audience, and I'm sure his audience knows him well enough to expect it. But I couldn't get away with saying any of thoses things in a "normal" high school or college game.

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by tref

+1

If we make comments like that, then kick a play later, its not gonna be pretty.

You are setting yourself up for failure by that stinkin thinkin. If you already think you are going to kick a call then you already have!! The key to YOUR scenario is to not kick a call!
I HAVE used those lines, wasving the 5th sub and saying "Come on, join the party" is my favorite, but as stated, it depends on audience and situation. I agree there are those that can and those that CAN'T get away with it. I have a partner who is a great friend but if he tried something like that, all hell would break loose. Conversely, he can do things and get away with that I can't. That's why boards like this are good for all b/c different people have different personalities.