Whistle for a sub?

[tomegun]

Do you use your whistle when calling in a sub or not and why? I have my opinion and would like to here others. While I know this is a small detail, I think some uniformity would be nice in our association. If it matters, we have table crew who are part of our association so they go through training.

While I'm at it, what do you think about officials reporting with two hands in a high school game? This may be a total contradiction to my first question, but I'm more concerned with officials getting calls right - which is a problem.

[Smitty]

I never blew the whistle for subs till I moved to Dallas, where they require it. Now that I'm used to it, I do it all the time. I moved to another association nearby where they don't require it, but I am still doing it. I don't like blowing the whistle more than necessary, but I like it even less when I have to blow my whistle because my partner didn't look to see my hand raised while I was bringing in subs and he's handing the ball for a throw in.

As far as reporting mechanics, I think when working high school ball you should use high school mechanics.

[tref]

I bring subs with a whistle. Sometimes in a crowded, loud gym we get distracted (coaches, hot moms, etc) during dead balls. I think the whistle catches everyones attention & prevents the ball from being inbounded with too many players on the court.

Two handed reporting in HS? I dont, some say its disrespecting the HS game by doing so...

[JRutledge]

I have changed my mind a few times on this over the years. I do blow my whistle most of the time for these as I would rather do that than have the horn buzzed. A lot of time the table blows the buzzer when it is not warranted and I tell the table to let us bring them in and no buzzer. I will not do it all the time or even in many situations. But it gets the players and official's attention on some level. But it is only used when it is needed, not every time there is a substitution.

Originally Posted by tomegun

While I'm at it, what do you think about officials reporting with two hands in a high school game? This may be a total contradiction to my first question, but I'm more concerned with officials getting calls right - which is a problem.

I forgot to answer this in my first post. I do not like it as it will be misconstrued too often by high school people at the table. I think that is why the mechanic says to use one hand. I think I will pass if they ever say we can do this. We do not use it in the leagues at the college level I work, so I do not see the big deal. Let women and NBA officials stay separate.

Peace

[CLH]

NCAA-W instructed us a few years back to whistle EVERY time you bring in subs. I think its a good idea because it lets your partners know that you have something going on. We all know there are times we or our partners get in a hurry and rush a throwin. A quick whistle gets everyones attention and can save you some embarassment.

As for two hand mechanics...The last time I used 1 hand was at the State Tournament, other than that, you'll always see me with two. For me, it has nothing to do with disrespecting the game, it has to do with me working other types of games which require it. I don't want to change my normal rhythms and habits on the court. It's hard enough with rule differences, two hand reporting just seems very trivial to me.

Just my $.02 worth!

[Rufus]

Using the whistle for subs will depend on whether or not it's necessary (like in transition, for instance). Most of the times on crews I've worked with either T or C will hold their hand up and beckon the sub(s) in. We pre-game to make eye contact before we inbound the ball so we don't get caught unaware during these situations.

We use two-hand reporting for fouls and that was a switch for me when I started back officiating a couple of years ago. When first getting started officiating it was drilled into my head to (1) always use one hand and (2) to make sure it's off to the side and not in front of your face. It's stupid but going to two hands to report numbers required more than a little practice and the first year doing it I sometimes resorted to getting the numbers "ready" when walking to report the foul.

[tomegun]

For those who are saying they use their whistle to get your partner's attention, is your table crew not doing their job? I know Rut says he tells them not to give him a horn, but other people haven't really been mentioning it. If the horn is going off, isn't this enough to get your partners attention?

Another reason I don't care for the whistle is communication. I'm going to vocalize a lot of things during a game that I don't hear from other officials. For instance, I have seen a ball bouncing away before inbounding and an official blows a whistle to "tell" a player to get the ball for him. Really? Why can't we talk? I have of the horn, "Blue sub" preference, but I'm listening.

As far as two-hand mechanics, I need patience. I was asked about it last year and was told "We are not college officials" by an official. I need patience in this situation because this particular officials, like many others, should be more concerned with making the right call before getting to the table. In my particular association I think we have bigger fish to fry. Again, I'm all ears.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by tomegun

For those who are saying they use their whistle to get your partner's attention, is your table crew not doing their job? I know Rut says he tells them not to give him a horn, but other people haven't really been mentioning it. If the horn is going off, isn't this enough to get your partners attention?

I'll mention it, then. In my meeting with the table, I instruct the timer to only give a horn for subs when we don't recognize them. It may happen once or twice a game where we're too slow for the timer or the timer's too quick for us. Frankly, my timing is better than theirs 99% of the time.

When watching JV games, it seems awkward watching the guys wait for the horn and then do the little wave to bring the player in.

I have always and will always report with one hand until told otherwise. However, I don't care if others use two hands.

[CLH]

Originally Posted by tomegun

For those who are saying they use their whistle to get your partner's attention, is your table crew not doing their job? I know Rut says he tells them not to give him a horn, but other people haven't really been mentioning it. If the horn is going off, isn't this enough to get your partners attention?

Another reason I don't care for the whistle is communication. I'm going to vocalize a lot of things during a game that I don't hear from other officials. For instance, I have seen a ball bouncing away before inbounding and an official blows a whistle to "tell" a player to get the ball for him. Really? Why can't we talk? I have of the horn, "Blue sub" preference, but I'm listening.

I'd love to work these game you guys get where the table does everything exactly as instructed and never misses a beat! Sounds just grand!

I'm not really sure what your second point has to do with a whistle for subs, but I'll go with it!

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by CLH

I'm not really sure what your second point has to do with a whistle for subs, but I'll go with it!

My second point has to do with using the whistle in a robotic manner instead of communicating...wait for it...with our mouths.

Our table crews are not perfect, but we aren't either. However, they do go through training and attend meetings like we do. They are taught to hit the horn so it isn't a big deal for them to do it consistently. I failed to mention, there are instances where a whistle is necessary like after the last free throw when a team may try to get the ball in quick.

[chartrusepengui]

Originally Posted by tomegun

For those who are saying they use their whistle to get your partner's attention, is your table crew not doing their job? I know Rut says he tells them not to give him a horn, but other people haven't really been mentioning it. If the horn is going off, isn't this enough to get your partners attention?

The horn going off is to get your attention, the whistle while waving subs on lets everyone know that a sub is coming into the game - there can be no error. Please, let's not assume that everyone running the clock, scoring, or officiating is always on the same page. We've all worked with people that don't pay enough attention at times. The whistle helps to eliminate confusion, and IMHO, also helps get the substitues attention so that they know they can enter the court. It also has helped in my area so that the minute the horns sounds they are not running onto the court - they must wait for the official to beckon them onto court - whith the whistle - they know which official to look at.

[APG]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Do you use your whistle when calling in a sub or not and why? I have my opinion and would like to here others. While I know this is a small detail, I think some uniformity would be nice in our association. If it matters, we have table crew who are part of our association so they go through training.

I used to not use my whistle for subs, but recently I've been told by those in my association that I should do it, so I do.

Originally Posted by tomegun

While I'm at it, what do you think about officials reporting with two hands in a high school game? This may be a total contradiction to my first question, but I'm more concerned with officials getting calls right - which is a problem.

Personally, I don't care. I think if I was working the table, I'd prefer for the officials to use two hands (let's ask our resident expert in all matters relating to the table ). If I had the choice I'd go to two handed reporting. As it is, we aren't allowed to do so in my association. so I only use it for double numbers.

[JBleach85]

I think it is a great thing to do and I would recommend it because sometimes the table doesn't even sound the horn because they forgot or they don't see the subs at the table. It is just a precaution to help you notify your partner and it also allows you to notify the table just incase they can't see the subs.

Peace
JB

[chseagle]

Originally Posted by tomegun

Do you use your whistle when calling in a sub or not and why? I have my opinion and would like to here others. While I know this is a small detail, I think some uniformity would be nice in our association. If it matters, we have table crew who are part of our association so they go through training.

While I'm at it, what do you think about officials reporting with two hands in a high school game? This may be a total contradiction to my first question, but I'm more concerned with officials getting calls right - which is a problem.

Tomegun,

In your association, is that all the table crews or just a few?

Concerning the whistle for subs, as has been mentioned in other posts, it opens up communication more between partners. As I've stated before in other posts, I would rather the floor officials signal for the subs instead of me having to hit the horn.

Concerning free throws & subs, I have my hand over the horn to buzz it in case the free throw is made. As soon as I see the ball in the net on the way down, I buzz as a courtesy, knowing that the floor officials have so much to watch at the time.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by chartrusepengui

The horn going off is to get your attention, the whistle while waving subs on lets everyone know that a sub is coming into the game - there can be no error. Please, let's not assume that everyone running the clock, scoring, or officiating is always on the same page. We've all worked with people that don't pay enough attention at times. The whistle helps to eliminate confusion, and IMHO, also helps get the substitues attention so that they know they can enter the court. It also has helped in my area so that the minute the horns sounds they are not running onto the court - they must wait for the official to beckon them onto court - whith the whistle - they know which official to look at.

I take your response as the most "matter of factly" so far. That being the case, why isn't it in the manual then? You know what I do? The horn sounds and in a voice so I can be heard I say...wait for it..."Subs!" If I'm in a situation where I cannot be heard I may use my whistle. This response causes me to ask the question: since we are always talking about making eye contact with our partners, where is the eye contact in this situation? My original question and the tables in Vegas blowing the horn are not absolutes and I don't expect eye contact with a partner to be either, but where is the eye contact we talk about in meetings, on this site and in pre-games?

If I'm coming off as argumentative right now I don't mean to. I have no problem talking things out and right now I'm seeing the reason people do this as a direct contradiction with what they always preach.