How to deal with the 3-sec rule

[wanja]

Here are some 3 seconds tips from a recent article .

3-SecondsTips/Reminders

• Prevent if we can, enforce if we must.


• A 3 second violation can occur only when there is team control in the front court


• A 3 second violation can occur when there is no player control
  (e.g. during an interrupted dribble or passing among teammates)
  


• The 3-second count is silent and not visible


• One or two alerts (e.g. stating “lane“) may effectively prevent
  3-second violations. Additional alerts or coaching (e.g. “get out
  of the lane”) are inadvisable.


• A violation occurs only after 3 seconds.


• When a 3 second count is reached




• Find the ball. If it has left a players hand on a
  try -- no team control, no 3 seconds. If there is any doubt that the player is still touching the ball during a try, do not call a violation.


• Check for movement in the restricted area. If a player starts to
  move to try for goal -- suspend. Under FIBA, NCAA, NBA and
  WNBA (but not NFHS) rules, also suspend the count if a player starts to
  move to exit the restricted area.




• Be Patient. Be sure. A player must clearly, without a doubt touch the restricted area to violate.
  3 seconds is not more than 3 seconds.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by wanja

Here are some 3 seconds tips from a recent article .

3-SecondsTips/Reminders

• Prevent if we can, enforce if we must.
  
• A 3 second violation can occur only when there is team control in the front court
  
• A 3 second violation can occur when there is no player control
  (e.g. during an interrupted dribble or passing among teammates)
  
• The 3-second count is silent and not visible
  
• One or two alerts (e.g. stating “lane“) may effectively prevent
  3-second violations. Additional alerts or coaching (e.g. “get out
  of the lane”) are inadvisable.
  
• A violation occurs only after 3 seconds.
  
• When a 3 second count is reached
  
  • Find the ball. If it is leaving or has left a players hand on a
    try -- no team control, no 3 seconds.
    
  • Check for movement in the restricted area. If a player starts to
    move to exit the restricted area, dribble or try for goal -- suspend.
    
  
  
• Be Patient. Be sure. Barely touching the lane boundary is not touching.
  3 seconds is not more than 3 seconds.
  

Care to list who is the author of that article? I have some serious objections to the writer's comments/instructions. Several of them are NOT supported by the rules.

[wanja]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Care to list who is the author of that article? I have some serious objections to the writer's comments/instructions. Several of them are NOT supported by the rules.

That would be me. The posting is an excerpt form an earlier posting on this forum that included the entire article. In the earlier post, I called on the wisdom of the forum to help me get it right. But better late than never. Please specify your objections.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by wanja

That would be me. The posting is an excerpt form an earlier posting on this forum that included the entire article. In the earlier post, I called on the wisdom of the forum to help me get it right. But better late than never. Please specify your objections.

• When a 3 second count is reached
  • Find the ball. If it is leaving or has left a players hand on a
    try -- no team control, no 3 seconds.
  • Check for movement in the restricted area. If a player starts to move to exit the restricted area, dribble or try for goal -- suspend.
• Be Patient. Be sure. Barely touching the lane boundary is not touching.
  3 seconds is not more than 3 seconds.

I've put the language to which I object in red. Here's why:

1. If a teammate still has the ball touching his hand when you locate it AFTER having reached a mental count of three on a player inside the lane, then this is team team control and the official should by rule penalize the violation. The ball must have left the shooter's hand to end team control.

2. There is no exception made for a player exiting the lane or moving to leave the FT lane. If he is in that area for more than three seconds, that's a violation by the book, plain and simple. He doesn't get a suspended count for dribbling in the lane either. The only correct exception which you list is a player moving to immediately try for goal.

3. Barely touching the lane, or even touching it with only one foot, IS touching the lane and deserves to be penalized under the letter of the rule as well as the spirit and intent of the rule. The NFHS stated this a couple of years ago.

Everything which you wrote in red is very poor teaching advice as it runs counter to the specifics of the rules book and the desire of the NFHS rules committee. The very reason that 3-seconds is an NFHS POE this season is because people fail to (or are unwilling to) call this properly and make all sorts of excuses to not penalize for it and come up with unfounded guidelines to go by instead of following the actual text of the rule. This results in the offense gaining an unfair advantage.

[wanja]

[QUOTE=Nevadaref;637861]

• When a 3 second count is reached
  • Find the ball. If it is leaving or has left a players hand on a
    try -- no team control, no 3 seconds.
  • Check for movement in the restricted area. If a player starts to move to exit the restricted area, dribble or try for goal -- suspend.
• Be Patient. Be sure. Barely touching the lane boundary is not touching.
  3 seconds is not more than 3 seconds.

Valid concerns. Most of the article addressed the 3-second rule literally and seconded the emphasis of the NCAA and NFHS to consistently enforce the rule. The wording you objected to in 3 of the tips was intended to emphasis that, like with most violations, it is preferable to be patient and sure at the expense of some violations not being penalized.

To your 3 points;

1. Yes, 'delete leaving the hand.' Player and team control ends when the ball has left the hand on a try. However, if there is any doubt about the player still touching the ball, do not call a violation.

2. The count is suspended when a 'player starts to exit the restricted area under FIBA, NCAA and NBA/WNBA rules but not NFHS rules. This should be specified.

3. "A player must clearly, without a doubt touch the boundary line to violate" is an accurate replacement for the the barely touching wording.


I have updated the original post in this thread to reflect these changes. The original article will also be updated.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by wanja

Valid concerns. Most of the article addressed the 3-second rule literally and seconded the emphasis of the NCAA and NFHS to consistently enforce the rule. The wording you objected to in 3 of the tips was intended to emphasis that, like with most violations, it is preferable to be patient and sure at the expense of some violations not being penalized.

To your 3 points;

1. Yes, 'delete leaving the hand.' Player and team control ends when the ball has left the hand on a try. However, if there is any doubt about the player still touching the ball, do not call a violation.

2. The count is suspended when a 'player starts to exit the restricted area under FIBA, NCAA and NBA/WNBA rules but not NFHS rules. This should be specified.

3. "A player must clearly, without a doubt touch the boundary line to violate" is an accurate replacement for the the barely touching wording.


I have updated the original post in this thread to reflect these changes. The original article will also be updated.

Well, you didn't have to do any of that for little ol' me, but I'll sleep better tonight.

[artar]

So if their is an offensive player in the paint getting the rebound, shooting, missing, rebounding again and shooting again (in the lane 6 seconds or longer) there is no 3 second violation because the player (or team) doesn't have contol of the ball?