Tech on Coach situation

Originally Posted by KSRef07

Instructing players on the bench is fine. Look, it's not my rule, its the KS state rule and they want it enforced. We all do.

Give me a break. I said it 10 times already - lenient - used as a tool if he begins to target the refs. Something along these lines - "Stop or we will strictly enforce the rule." If still no improvement, then tell him to sit unless directly instructing the players. If still no improvement then a T the next time he demonstrably disputes a call. Then he sits for good.

Maybe it's just me, and it's after midnight, but in the first sentence you say it is the KS state rule and they and everyone else wants it enforced. OK, fine then enforce it.

Then in the next sentence, you say you're lenient and give them 3 chances to comply.

If a coach repeatedly stands and demonstrably disputes a call, any official, will T him up. But that's because of his actions. I'm not going to tell him he has to sit if he's not instructing his players though. (at least not until after the T )

Originally Posted by 26 Year Gap

Is it a coincidence that KSref joined this month and Old School has been gone for about a month?

I think you're on to something....

Originally Posted by PYRef

Maybe it's just me, and it's after midnight, but in the first sentence you say it is the KS state rule and they and everyone else wants it enforced. OK, fine then enforce it.

Then in the next sentence, you say you're lenient and give them 3 chances to comply.

If a coach repeatedly stands and demonstrably disputes a call, any official, will T him up. But that's because of his actions. I'm not going to tell him he has to sit if he's not instructing his players though. (at least not until after the T )

In case you have not been around the game a long time, enforcement is open to some interpretation - called game management. Do you call every foul by the letter of the rule? For instance, I never SEE a pregame dunk. I HEAR it and address it without a T.

Look, it's handled in the pregame conference. We state what the coaches box rule is. "You can stand to instruct your players but then you must sit back down. We will give some leeway but don't use the box to address the refs."

The first violation - MY game management style - gets the letter of the law enforced with a warning. The next gets the T and a permanent seat. Unless of course the F bomb or some such is dropped right off.

Why argue with me about how a certain state handles the situation? I am just telling you how it is for informational purposes. Have a nice night.

[Nevadaref]

KSref07,
Welcome to the forum. I think that some are being too hard on you in this thread.

You will quickly find that JR always asks people to back things up with a rule citation. In fact, I would have inquired about your initial statements, if he had not.

In this case you have done just that by providing the KS interpretation. We may not all agree with that viewpoint, but if that is the way it is handled in your state, that's great. (Personally, I like it, but that's not how it's done where I am. FYI soccer does exactly what KS does, not HS, but the FIFA game.)

Just be aware that not every other state makes the same interp. I've learned a great deal from the people on this forum, who are from all over, one of the most important being that there are many differences from place to place.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

KSref07,

You will quickly find that JR always asks people to back things up with a rule citation.

Yup, and especially when they state something that is complete and utter boolsh!t under the rules.

I'm funny like that.

If that's a local interpretation put out by a state governing body, fine. Don't try to tell me that it's a rule everywhere though. It isn't and never has been. Afaik, that particular interpretation hasn't ever been used anywhere outside of Kansas.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

Do you call every foul by the letter of the rule? For instance, I never SEE a pregame dunk. I HEAR it and address it without a T.

Please tell me that you're not serious.

Please.

How do you know for sure that the player didn't hit the side or bottom of the ring with the ball while screwing up a lay-up? How do you know that the player didn't throw the ball at the ring sideways from 3 feet away?

If you hear but don't see a slap by a defender, do you address that with a foul also?

Lah me......let's call the game by ear. It doesn't matter that you actually never saw what happens. Un-freaking-believable.

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Please tell me that you're not serious.

If I interpret correctly what OS...oops... I mean KSRef is saying here, is that he will pretend he did not see a dunk and say that he only heard someone dunk. Therefore, because he is so compassionate and lenient with the rule, he will just say something to the team and as a result, not have to issue a T.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by PYRef

If I interpret correctly what OS...oops... I mean KSRef is saying here, is that he will pretend he did not see a dunk and say that he only heard someone dunk. Therefore, because he is so compassionate and lenient with the rule, he will just say something to the team and as a result, not have to issue a T.

Any way that he wants to say it or do it, he's completely wrong anyway. Ignoring a pre-game dunk because you don't want to call a "T" sureasheck has got nothing to do with "game management". It's got more to do with a lack of testicular fortitude imo.

[rainmaker]

KSREF --

Here's the down-low on the scene here. It may be that you've found what works for you at your level, in your area. You'll quickly learn that others on this site find that different ways work for them at their levels, in their areas. And there are those that scoff at describing the problem as being different ways in different situations. You've been told how to handle things in Kansas, and that's what you need to do. Don't worry about the argument too much. Back down gracefully by saying, "Hmm I see what you mean, I'll think about that" or some such. That helps avoid the OS references.

Also, I want to thank you for continuing this discussion. We've been trying for years to figure out where Jurassic lives, and now we can rule out Kansas!

[Vinski]

Could it be OS reincarnated? Normally, only OS could get JR’s dander up like this.
To bad if it is. The board was beginning to be a more tranquil place.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by Vinski

Could it be OS reincarnated? Normally, only OS could get JR’s dander up like this.
To bad if it is. The board was beginning to be a more tranquil place.

Nah. This is really the only thread where KSR has caused any flap, and he's been pretty consistent here, and actually pretty articulate. I really doubt it's OS. Although time will tell.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

Here is one.
Colorado
COACHING BOX
The head coach may be off the bench in front of his or her seat within the confines of the designated coaches’ box to give instructions to his or her players and/or substitutes.

This does not mean what you think it does. I can tell you difinitively that we (Colorado officials or the CHFAA organization) do not interpret this rule as you do. No attempt is made to define coaching in such a limited way. This phrase is simply there to differentiate between coaching and whining to the officials.

I do know Iowa has, at least in the past, agreed with you with regard to kneeling. I can definitely see some basis for agreement on that issue.

But to try and say "coaching" must be "active" and include talking or gesturing? That's someone at a very high level on a power trip.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Vinski

Normally, only OS could get JR’s dander up like this.

Stick around. Nevada will get JRs hackles in a bunch this season (probably this month.)

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

Nah. This is really the only thread where KSR has caused any flap, and he's been pretty consistent here, and actually pretty articulate. I really doubt it's OS. Although time will tell.

Could be that OS took the mandatory Articulation class that they have in Kansas.

[Camron Rust]

Quite seriously, KS, you are utterly and completely wrong on what coaching is.