Tech on Coach situation

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

In fact, I charged a T for this just last season while working with our assignor!

What does that tell you?

Uhmmm, that if you had been at KSRef's school he would have told on you and you would never, ever get to ref there again??

No? That's not it? OK...well then, maybe it tells us that your Assignor has more testicular fortitude than the assignor in KSRef's area?

[Idaho]

Originally Posted by Brad

You know, one thing that I have learned not only in officiating, but in life... If you are strenuously arguing one side of an issue and almost everyone else is on the other side telling you that you are wrong, you might want to reevaluate.

Interesting.

The other night, I called a double foul while Team A was in posession. Everyone in the gym wanted the ball to be put in play by AP. Including my partner. I said it should be POI.

I chose not to reevaluate.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Brad

This explains everything.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing.

btw...if I was Francine whats-her-name I would not be happy with anyone putting my phone number & email address on a public forum...just saying but I hope she has a good sense of humor (and good spamware).

Originally Posted by Idaho

Interesting.

The other night, I called a double foul while Team A was in posession. Everyone in the gym wanted the ball to be put in play by AP. Including my partner. I said it should be POI.

I chose not to reevaluate.

Great post. Just think where this country would be if we always listened to the majority.

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing.

btw...if I was Francine whats-her-name I would not be happy with anyone putting my phone number & email address on a public forum...just saying but I hope she has a good sense of humor (and good spamware).

Uhh, don't think because you hurt the team. JK! The KSHSAA numbers are all on the web along with her number. http://www.kshsaa.org/staff.html.

Being a former coach and now a ref gives special insights to the officiating game those that have not coached usually don't have. Those insights, for example, allow such refs to recognize and anticipate plays as they are developing and allows them to be ready for potential action and not be surprised. It also, in general, gives a certain rapport with other coaches that is unique.

It's not unusual that those having never been down a certain path tend to dismiss it. I think that comes from an inner feeling of inadequacy.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

From KCRef07: "Under NO circumstances can an assistant coach stand."

May an assistant coach, during a live ball, while the clock is running, stand to approach the scorer's table to inquire about the number of fouls on a player, or the number a time outs remaining? I don't believe that a head coach is allowed to do this?

I'm getting here later but....

NO, ABSOLTUELY NOT!!!!!!!!!!

[Rich]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

When my AD and I call the assignor and tell him not to schedule Rust at our venue anymore, Rust will not be at our venue anymore. The school is not beholden to the assignor - just the opposite.

Maybe in Kansas, it's not like that everywhere.

When I lived in Tennessee, if an AD or coach made that kind of a phone call, the official they were complaining about would work the next four games there.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

Uhh, don't think because you hurt the team. JK! The KSHSAA numbers are all on the web along with her number. http://www.kshsaa.org/staff.html.

Being a former coach and now a ref gives special insights to the officiating game those that have not coached usually don't have. Those insights, for example, allow such refs to recognize and anticipate plays as they are developing and allows them to be ready for potential action and not be surprised. It also, in general, gives a certain rapport with other coaches that is unique.

It's not unusual that those having never been down a certain path tend to dismiss it. I think that comes from an inner feeling of inadequacy.

Good God, now I understand. Here's a coach who thinks being a coach automatically makes him a better official. He probably also thinks that his poop doesn't smell, either.

I work in a school/league-assigns-the-official system and I call the games just the same as if I had an independent assignor. Hasn't hurt my 40+ game schedule year after year.

Just read this thread tonight, but why would anyone want the responsibility of determining whether a coach is actively coaching? As long as he's in our 14-foot-box not b!tching at me or not getting in my way when I'm the center I'm a happy man.

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Good God, now I understand. Here's a coach who thinks being a coach automatically makes him a better official. He probably also thinks that his poop doesn't smell, either.

I work in a school/league-assigns-the-official system and I call the games just the same as if I had an independent assignor. Hasn't hurt my 40+ game schedule year after year.

Just read this thread tonight, but why would anyone want the responsibility of determining whether a coach is actively coaching? As long as he's in our 14-foot-box not b!tching at me or not getting in my way when I'm the center I'm a happy man.

Well, here's a Johnny come lately to the thread....

Where did I say it AUTOMATICALLY makes us better officials? Are you a little intimidated that someone can be a good coach AND a good ref? You tell me, if you had equally good refs in ALL respects, but one had the additional insight of being a varsity coach, which one would you want as a partner or to ref your game?

Where did I say I wanted the responsibility of determining.... If you read the thread, you would know this is not the case.

Great for you and your 40 game schedule. Talk to me when you log over 300 per year.

Oh and by the way, grow up.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

Oh and by the way, grow up.

KSRef - it is these kind of comments that are not exactly endearing you to other officials and to the LONG-TIME members of this board.

I'd suggest being less sarcastic and snarky in your posts if you expect to get along here.

I've seen some great former-coach refs and some poor ones. I've seen some great former-player refs and some poor ones. Just because you have experienced the game from another perspective doesn't make you a great official.

One question: Is this your first year officiating?

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

When I was a varsity coach, if you were at my varsity boys game and you called a T on my player with no warning and started the game that way, my AD and I would make sure you NEVER reffed another one of my games again.

That bullsh!t may work is your state but it wouldn't fly here. Unless you could supply film that showed I had set aside a rule, my assignor would not only ignore your "request," he's likely to send me right back over there very, very soon. And, he would probably be sitting in the stands that night as well. BTW, the state association would back both of us.

Coaches and ADs have no such power here, nor should they anywhere. Such childish threats are foolish and out dated. Boy, talk about somebody on a power trip.

JR, make sure you ask Ms. Martin if it's the KHSAA's stand that pre-game dunks should be ignored. If so, ask her what other rules they have decided to ignore and if in doing so, they have given up their vote on the NFHS Basketball Rules Committee. I'm dying to hear back from her.

PS KSRef - You might want to listen to Brad. He's the administrator of this site.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by KSRef07
Page 3 - Coaching Box: "The executive Board has approved the optional six-foot (6') coaching box for the 2007-08 season. Only the HEAD COACH may be off the bench in front of his/her seat within the confines of the designated coaches' box to give instructions to his/her players and/or substitutes. The head coach may:
1) Stand to instruct (coach) then,
2) Sit down
3) Not kneel, squat,pace or stand during a live ball.

Coaches not complying are to be assessed the appropriate penalty of a technical foul. Once either a direct or indirect "T" is assessed, the coach(es) MUST comply with provisions of Rule 10-5-1 and 10-5-2 for the remainder of the game. Officials SHALL file the appropriate report on Loss of Coaching Box privilege Form (2007-08 Blue). The form may also be submitted online by logging into the officials website."

Originally Posted by RichMSN

........why would anyone want the responsibility of determining whether a coach is actively coaching?

And whether you want it or not I would say this fall into the category of:

If you're watching this, you're not seeing much else.

As written above, I see no way to "strictly enforce" this policy. How long a pause is allowed between sentences? (coaching "instructions")

My thought is that someone in Kansas simply had the idea to "put some teeth in it" to the point that when a coach did get out of line to draw a T, he would have absolutely no room to complain. Unfortunately, in my opinion, when you go to too much of an extreme the other way, it tends to be ounterproductive. Kinda like the speed limit 5 mph sign. Nobody ever really got into trouble for going 7 or 8 mph, did they?

[jer166]

dang this is entertaining as well as educational. Wish I could add something, but everytime I think of a constructive response somone beats me to it or I'm laughing so hard I forget the context of my reply.

Keep it going though.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

Great for you and your 40 game schedule. Talk to me when you log over 300 per year.

You're saying you call 300+ games a year? Or you're saying this is how you supplement your income from your regular job as a logger?

Originally Posted by Brad

KSRef - it is these kind of comments that are not exactly endearing you to other officials and to the LONG-TIME members of this board.

I'd suggest being less sarcastic and snarky in your posts if you expect to get along here.

I've seen some great former-coach refs and some poor ones. I've seen some great former-player refs and some poor ones. Just because you have experienced the game from another perspective doesn't make you a great official.

One question: Is this your first year officiating?

Before you castigate me and delete my posts, look at the originator that caused the reaction. I have not responded to ANY post with my FIRST post being "snarky". Only when someone used vulgar langauge at me, called me stupid, etc.

15th year thank you. And how long have you been officiating?