Bounce pass to self

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by just another ref

By definition, a dribble is when the ball is pushed to the floor. Therefore, in my judgment, if the first push to the floor is a dribble, not a drop, not a bounce pass, that is when the violation occurs, not on a second touch. What if the defender picks his pocket after the ball is first pushed to the floor, does this save a violation? I think not.

According to R4-15-3, a dribble starts when a player pushes, throws or bats the ball to the floor. And, according to R4-31, a pass occurs when a player throws, bats or rolls the ball to another player. He can also legally throw or bat the ball to the floor at the start of the pass too. How do you differentiate between the throw or bat that start both a dribble and a pass then? Answer- you and Nevada don't. You both say that throw or bat has to be a second dribble and you call a violation.

If you can determine instantly the split-second that a ball leaves the player's hands after he's ended his dribble that his throw or bat is actually a dribble and not a pass, you're a helluva lot better official than I am. Dare I say....you're almost god-like.

Note that a two-handed bounce pass and a two-handed power dribble by definition are started exactly the same way.

I'm tired of repeating the same thing over and over.You and Nevada call it any way you want. I'd just like to be there the first time that a player does pass the ball and you two call that pass an illegal dribble.