Throw in kick ball

[just another ref]

After wading through 15 pages which had long since dissolved into a you know who ridiculousness festival, I thought a question about the original issue might be worth a fresh start. Trail official hands A1 the ball for a throw-in at the end line. He throws a long pass which B1 kicks at the division line. C blows his whistle and signals the violation at the same time, or yes, maybe even a fraction before the T chops the clock. We're not going to take any time off for this, are we?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Trail official hands A1 the ball for a throw-in at the end line. He throws a long pass which B1 kicks at the division line. C blows his whistle and signals the violation at the same time, or yes, maybe even a fraction before the T chops the clock. We're not going to take any time off for this, are we?

The timer should have started and stopped the clock under FED rules. However, you can't take any time off unless you know exactly how much time to take off. You don't know that in this case, so you can't change the time.

Team A gets the ball for a spot throw-in at the closest OOB spot to B1's kick. If it was an AP throw-in, A keeps the arrow.

The rules on starting/stopping the clock are 5-9-4&1. The applicable rules re: a timing mistake are 5-10-1&2. The OOB spot for the violation is rule 7-5-2. The rules for A keeping the arrow are new 4-42-5 and 6-4-4.

[rainmaker]

Now lock it up quick! Before it gets all *%$#@#$%^

[Mark Dexter]

Agree on all five counts.

Now lock 'er down.

[just another ref]

My point was that if 2 different officials made the two different calls, (start clock on touch, stop clock for violation) it is easy to realize that the 2 calls do happen at the same time. It was stated that we cannot take time off because we do not know how much to take. In fact we do know how much to take, none, because the start and the stop, by rule, take place at the same time. Furthermore, it should not be any more difficult to accept this situation, even if only one official is involved. The official simply keeps his hand up and whistles the violation and does not chop the clock. I'm sure that we all have seen this call made, but I personally could not say whether any time ran off the clock or not. What I do know is that I have seen B1 jump up and swat the inbounds pass and the ball hits the wall behind A1 and the clock never starts. Certainly no adjustment could be made here because of the tiny fraction of a second involved. So, having recognized all that, can we not recognize that the kick/touch.......clock start/clock stop things are one and that no time should run off? As written, 5-8-1 & 5-9-4 are contradictory. The same act is supposed to start the clock and stop the clock. To whom should Nevada write a letter about this?

[BktBallRef]

There's no contradiction. As JR said, the clock should have stopped and started. If it did, fine. If it didn't, no adjustment can be made as we don't have definite knowledge. Personally, I don't see why that's so difficult.