2007-08 Major Mechanics Changes

[M&M Guy]

Fwiw, setting the ball down at the throw-in spot has been a mechanic in NCAA-W for a couple of years now. (Or, maybe it was just last year, with it being an experimental mechanic the year before?) Anyway, I was against it for all the reasons listed above - people tripping over it, kicking it away, taking it when you're not looking, etc. But I have not seen or heard any examples of those problems. The main reason for this mechanic is communication with the players and coaches as to where the ball is to be put in play. Usually the best example of this happens near the end of a game - there's a turnover, the ball goes OOB along the baseline, then there's a TO. The crew might get together near center court to go over things (who's got last shot, watch for the trap on the throw-in, keep an eye out for intentional fouls, white's in the bonus, but blue still has only 5, let's stay in this one, etc.), and that's when usually an asst. coach sticks their head out of the huddle and asks, "Where's the ball?". Now all we have to do is point at the ball sitting right on the throw-in spot.

In most other normal game situations, the official administering the throw-in will be standing right next to the ball, so there are less opportunities for shenanigans and stuff. I was against the mechanic in the beginning, but I've grown accustomed to it.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by JohnBark

don't like the first change at all

and where are you going to stand if when the timeout is called and the ball is in front of the bench? i guess you become part of that team's huddle right? that will be fun if the coach is upset with you. and then what happens if the other team's coach has a question and you set the ball down and the other team breaks their huddle the kicks the ball acrossed the court? not to mention the cheerleaders mentioned in a previous post.

Good grief.

Some people can find a problem anywhere they look.

It says you "may" do it. It does NOT say you "have" to do it.

The mechanic for standing out on the floor away, from the bench, when the ball is going to be put in play in front of the bench has not changed.

[JohnBark]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Good grief.

Some people can find a problem anywhere they look.

It says you "may" do it. It does NOT say you "have" to do it.

The mechanic for standing out on the floor away, from the bench, when the ball is going to be put in play in front of the bench has not changed.

are you just referring to me? or the others that don't like the changes too?

Good grief indeed!

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by JohnBark

are you just referring to me? or the others that don't like the changes too?

Good grief indeed!

Ah.....who did I quote?

The rule has nothing to do with standing in front of the bench. Did we stand in front of the bench last year? No. We moved onto the floor away from the bench. What do you see in the original post that says that's changed? Where does it say you have to put the ball down before going to speak to the opposing coach?

Sad day.

[LarryS]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

The NFHS just posted these mechanics changes. What do people think of them?
The first one matches the NCAA rule. The second reverts back to the way it used to be done by the NFHS and has always been done by IAABO, since that group never changed. The final one goes against previous advice of not leaving the ball on the floor unattended.



2007-08 MAJOR MECHANICS CHANGES

211; 321: The referee may designate the official to administer the jump ball to start the game or overtime.

273; 275; Diagram 29: Crew of Two Only: Change the time-out and intermission positions so that the administering official will stand where play will be resumed and the non-administering official will stand, facing the table, on the division line (on the circle nearest the table for a 30-second time-out or intermission).

273; 378: During a time-out or intermission, the administering official may set the ball down on the floor where play will be resumed if movement is necessary away from the spot to communicate with the table/partner(s).

I think this is what drew the "good grief" comment. We have all these people concerned about the legal ramifications should someone trip over the basketball while it is on the floor and all the problems that can arise if someone moves/hides/steals the ball.

How about this...since, with one possible exception, the posters here are at least semi-intelligent and observant...IF YOU THINK SOMEONE WILL GET HURT FROM A SITTING BALL OR MOVE, HIDE OR STEAL THE BALL...DO NOT SET IT DOWN!

It states the official MAY set the ball down on the floor (not sure how one would set it UP on the floor, but that is a different discussion), not that the official MUST set the ball down on the floor.

IMO, if you are a good enough official to be assigned a varsity game you should be alert and observant enough to know when it is safe to use that option.

[JRutledge]

Believe it or not some here even think the MAY is a bad use of language for this mechanic. And believe it or not, someone will not look at this as MAY and might use this as a reason to ding officials over. The point that I have made we did not need this mechanic even as a MAY as apart of the language.

Remember not everyone that uses NF mechanics are 10, 20, and 30 year veterans and will know when to use and when not to use mechanics. There will be some young officials that might do something they read and take it to heart more than someone like me that has been around might know when to pick and choose. Also not all levels are the same. Working a freshman game where 10 people are in the stands are a little different than working a sophomore or varsity game where cheerleaders might more likely be present and the atmosphere is drastically different. I am not concerned about veterans that have been around the game, I am more concern with the newer official that is worried about what they are calling than the many things going on during a timeout which a veteran might do as common place.

Peace

[JohnBark]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Ah.....who did I quote?

The rule has nothing to do with standing in front of the bench. Did we stand in front of the bench last year? No. We moved onto the floor away from the bench. What do you see in the original post that says that's changed? Where does it say you have to put the ball down before going to speak to the opposing coach?

Sad day.

10,000+ post to just over 100 post...hmmm...as Rut mentioned you never know which one of you vets is going to ding a younger guy for something like "MAY" and that something you "MAY" not like might be something you vets already do but just want to ding a younger guy, just because you have more experience doesn't make it right...i guess i need a few more than 100+ posts to get a "little" respect from vets like you...

sad day indeed!!!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JohnBark

10,000+ post to just over 100 post...hmmm...as Rut mentioned you never know which one of you vets is going to ding a younger guy for something like "MAY" and that something you "MAY" not like might be something you vets already do but just want to ding a younger guy, just because you have more experience doesn't make it right...i guess i need a few more than 100+ posts to get a "little" respect from vets like you...

Well, I don't have a schnauzer in this particular dog fight but.......the way it works here is that you get respect for what you post, not the number of times that you post.

Back to our regular programming.....

[JohnBark]

predictable!

[Adam]

John, he was responding to something very specific in your post that was incorrect; or it at least had incorrect implications.
Resorting to complaining about how the vets are picking on you? That's your response? Wow.

[JohnBark]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

John, he was responding to something very specific in your post that was incorrect; or it at least had incorrect implications.
Resorting to complaining about how the vets are picking on you? That's your response? Wow.

my bad, my bad...must be the lack of coaches chatting with me or maybe just the cold of the North...my apologies to BktBallRef and the rest of you all...my wife says I was doing the very same thing I dislike the most about this forum...

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by JohnBark

10,000+ post to just over 100 post...hmmm...as Rut mentioned you never know which one of you vets is going to ding a younger guy for something like "MAY" and that something you "MAY" not like might be something you vets already do but just want to ding a younger guy, just because you have more experience doesn't make it right...i guess i need a few more than 100+ posts to get a "little" respect from vets like you...

sad day indeed!!!

It makes no difference to me whether you just got here or you've been here 10 years. The info presented in your post was incorrect. Don't be so sensitive about it. It's just discussion.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JohnBark

my bad, my bad...must be the lack of coaches chatting with me or maybe just the cold of the North...my apologies to BktBallRef and the rest of you all...my wife says I was doing the very same thing I dislike the most about this forum...

We all do it occasionally.

[JohnBark]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

It makes no difference to me whether you just got here or you've been here 10 years. The info presented in your post was incorrect. Don't be so sensitive about it. It's just discussion.

You are right...

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

The NFHS just posted these mechanics changes. What do people think of them?
The first one matches the NCAA rule. The second reverts back to the way it used to be done by the NFHS and has always been done by IAABO, since that group never changed. The final one goes against previous advice of not leaving the ball on the floor unattended.



2007-08 MAJOR MECHANICS CHANGES

211; 321: The referee may designate the official to administer the jump ball to start the game or overtime.

273; 275; Diagram 29: Crew of Two Only: Change the time-out and intermission positions so that the administering official will stand where play will be resumed and the non-administering official will stand, facing the table, on the division line (on the circle nearest the table for a 30-second time-out or intermission).

273; 378: During a time-out or intermission, the administering official may set the ball down on the floor where play will be resumed if movement is necessary away from the spot to communicate with the table/partner(s).

Sounds good to me, all three.