Woman's College Mechanics

[Junker]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

Actually heard it the other way around that we would all be going the route of Womens mechanics

If you work it alot with a crew that is comforatble in the transitioning primary areas I like it better than the mens.

but it comes down to what you are more comfortable with.

I hope we don't all go to women's. My main gripe about it is that, to me, the biggest benefit to the 3 person crew is having that lead down there working the post. You are in close proximity, you see things, you can communicate with players and really clean up the game. To me, having the lead go out to the corner and officiate matchups in the corner takes that advantage away.

[Mwanr1]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Do you need to know the coverage areas as well? I believe that the women's coverage areas are the same as HS for 3-person -- EXCEPT that the Lead 's area doesn't stop at the 3-point arc; it extends all the way to the sideline. So in NCAAW, the Lead has primary coverage on a 3-point shot from the corner.

The coverage may also be slightly different regarding where the T and C coverages meet above the 3-point arc. In HS, the Trail has primary coverage all the way to the far lane line; but in NCAAW, they might split the top of the frontcourt right down the middle.

Mechanics-wise, NCAAW differs from HS in a few ways: they "walk and talk" while reporting a foul, and they use 2 hands to give the fouler's number. The right hand is the 10's digit and the left hand is the 1's digit, so that it reads normally to the scorer. So they report just like the NBA refs.

NCAAW also give responsibility for the last shot to the Center official always. It's NOT the official opposite the table, as in HS. Whoever is C, takes the last shot. This means that in the last shot clock possession of the half (or game, or OT period), the officials "lock down", they will NOT rotate. This is to ensure that there's no confusion over who the C is for the last shot. I believe the Lead may still come ball side if he/she needs to, but the outside officials will not complete the rotation. As I said, I think this is only in the last 30 seconds of a period.

I think those are the major ones. Coverage, last second, and reporting. There are obviously rule differences too, that you should be aware of, but I'm not the person to ask about that.

If I've got any of it wrong so far, somebody who's more accomplished than I am on the women's side will correct it for you.

Good luck at camp!

Trail will also "chop" to start the time when the play is inbounding in the FC by the lead official

[OHBBREF]

Originally Posted by Junker

My main gripe about it is that, to me, the biggest benefit to the 3 person crew is having that lead down there working the post. You are in close proximity, you see things, you can communicate with players and really clean up the game. To me, having the lead go out to the corner and officiate matchups in the corner takes that advantage away.

That is what the C and the T are for.
If you have a match up that you can not give up the T shouldn't give up the ball, when you take the ball the C has the weak side and the T helps on the strong side. The proximity is different but it works well - you have to trust your partners and communicate

[Junker]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

That is what the C and the T are for.
If you have a match up that you can not give up the T shouldn't give up the ball, when you take the ball the C has the weak side and the T helps on the strong side. The proximity is different but it works well - you have to trust your partners and communicate

I agree. Trusting your partners and calling your area is important. I just think the proximity to the paint is a major advantage of 3 person mechanics.

[Mwanr1]

Question: FOR NCAA MEN, in Frontcourt, does the T administer the throw in when the ball is below the free-throw line extended? Or is it the L's responsibility?

I know in NCAAW, it is the "L"s responsibility. In HS, it is the "T"

Please verify

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Mwanr1

Question: FOR NCAA MEN, in Frontcourt, does the T administer the throw in when the ball is below the free-throw line extended? Or is it the L's responsibility?

I know in NCAAW, it is the "L"s responsibility. In HS, it is the "T"

Please verify

(HS) Not necessarily. If it is on the lead's sideline, the lead may bounce the ball up the sideline to the thrower (and stay lead). Above the FT line, the lead will switch and become the T.

[Mwanr1]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

(HS) Not necessarily. If it is on the lead's sideline, the lead may bounce the ball up the sideline to the thrower (and stay lead). Above the FT line, the lead will switch and become the T.

Now I'm confused... why would the L switch to become T on OOB?

[JoeTheRef]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

(HS) Not necessarily. If it is on the lead's sideline, the lead may bounce the ball up the sideline to the thrower (and stay lead). Above the FT line, the lead will switch and become the T.

CR, you are referring to the 2-man mechanic, correct? I think he's questioning 3-whistle.

[JoeTheRef]

Originally Posted by Mwanr1

Question: FOR NCAA MEN, in Frontcourt, does the T administer the throw in when the ball is below the free-throw line extended? Or is it the L's responsibility?

I know in NCAAW, it is the "L"s responsibility. In HS, it is the "T"

Please verify

Our State HS association uses women's college mechanics, so the L administers this throw-in. Not sure if the men's mechanic is different.

[Camron Rust]

Yes, I was referring to 2-man mechanics. For 3, I would be incorrect and he was right all along.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by tmp44

This is an incorrect mechanic. Once the L picks up the ball in the deep corner in his/her primary, it is now the trail's responsibility to watch the post. If the L would simply "turn his head," L would have no idea how either the offensive player or the defensive player got there.

So, again, if the L picks up the ball in the deep corner, the trail picks up the post action.

True on the first part, but once the Lead doesn't have anything to officiate in the deep corner, he comes down to get that and has primary over the play. The T will verifiy thru eye contact that the L now has the play and be secondary on the play. Kind of like when you have the dribbler from the T and he moves into the C's primary. The minute he picks up the dribble, it is now C's responsibly. You still need eye contact from the C before you let it go.

[Mwanr1]

Originally Posted by Old School

True on the first part, but once the Lead doesn't have anything to officiate in the deep corner, he comes down to get that and has primary over the play. The T will verifiy thru eye contact that the L now has the play and be secondary on the play. Kind of like when you have the dribbler from the T and he moves into the C's primary. The minute he picks up the dribble, it is now C's responsibly. You still need eye contact from the C before you let it go.

Eye Contact or body language (square up to the play) to let you know that he/she's got that matchup

[Old School]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

Well we are going to have to disagree on that point because like I said I have never come across it in the womens game - in any pre game or last minute discussion we have had going in to a possible last possession in my time - but maybe you guys do that.

I can tell you this, you better not let an observer, catch you failing to rotate for that reason.
I have seen crews get reemed for not making late rotations, (not to put the C in the opposite position), but just failing to make a needed rotation late in a game or half.

I totally agree but what you fail to understand is the reason why. Let me try to explain. If you're late in the game (HS/Men's NCAA) less than 5 seconds to play and the game is close. Then you have a quick turnover and now the last shot is in transistion towards the other bucket. If I was still the T, I would become the new Lead and have to get all the way down to the other end and still have last second shot responsiblity because we're locked. If you can make the T the C, and lock the C opposite the table, you now have the best scenario (for the officials) for the last second shot at either ends. If the C is table side, you get a quick turnover, you got the bench players jumping up, etc., coach standing up, etc., the best scenario for us is opposite the table and the C with the responsiblity.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Mwanr1

Eye Contact or body language (square up to the play) to let you know that he/she's got that matchup

Body language to confirm that he has it before you release it. good point!

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Old School

I totally agree but what you fail to understand is the reason why. Let me try to explain. If you're late in the game (HS/Men's NCAA) less than 5 seconds to play and the game is close. Then you have a quick turnover and now the last shot is in transistion towards the other bucket. If I was still the T, I would become the new Lead and have to get all the way down to the other end and still have last second shot responsiblity because we're locked. If you can make the T the C, and lock the C opposite the table, you now have the best scenario (for the officials) for the last second shot at either ends. If the C is table side, you get a quick turnover, you got the bench players jumping up, etc., coach standing up, etc., the best scenario for us is opposite the table and the C with the responsiblity.

that's the rationale for making the opposite side the C in NFHS and men's mechanics. It has nothing to do with making the C the opposite side in women's mechanics.