Backcourt Violation - Mavs Heat

[mcuban]

Well Mark, who the best officials and the worst officials are is very subjective point of view. Also the "best" cannot work every night and every game. Someone that is not the "best" is going to work some time.



MC -During the regular season, you are correct. During the finals ? Is it that demanding that the officials need more days off than the players ? My highest level is rec league, so i cant speak from experience , but Im guessing the best crew might be able to handle it. How does it work in the NCAA Finals ?




Yes I have Mark. I have also talked to some officials in the NBA. It is not all peaches and cream and it is also a game that many "amateur" officials like or even respect. Other than a few playoff games I cannot watch the NBA anymore.


MC - Now you are talking to where I can and do have an impact, what dont you like about the NBA game ?






This statement does not even make any sense. Either way it goes not everyone wants to be in the NBA.


MC -The statement reflects our practices and supports your comments about payscale and demand.

[mcuban]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Well, it it is Cuban, tell him for me that he's a whining, cry-baby typical fanboy that needs to do a whole lot of growing up. If it isn't, tell whoever it is the same damn thing.

To all the Maverick fans out there---in the immortal words of Charles Barkley-- "Why can't you take your azz-whipping like a man and go home".

kind of like the *** whipping you took on the NBA block/charge rules...

You still bitter JR ?

m

[mcuban]

So it's only certain refs who are out to screw you, to cheat you, that are part of the conspiracy?

MC- Where do you get this conspiracy nonsense ? You dont believe what sportswriters and columnists write do you ? If there was a conspiracy against me, we never would have made it past memphis let alone the Spurs...




I've talked to plenty of them. Several post here. What would you like to know?

MC- The more i know about the process to get into the NBA, the good and bad, the better I can work to improve it. BElieve it or not, the NBA top brass had no understanding about the camp process until I sat and explained it to them. It was completely foreign to them that the people running the camps were the same running the conferences that happened to be the same conferences that most of our new officials came from.

the more i learn, the better I can make the process. The better i can make the process, the better officials we get into the NBA.




Yes, what you say is true. But those that work Belmont vs. Winthrop are the newest officials in the league. And those officials aren;'t working the NBA FInals. Joe DeRosa worked in the SEC and the old Metro Conference before coming to the NBA. Joe Forte was an ACC and Final Four official. Violet Palmer worked Women's FInal Fours before coming to the NBA. Most of the guys who have been in the league for more than 20 years have their college careers in their distant past.


MC- Understood. The real reason is why. The 15 plus year guys came through a different process than the current process. The question is what is the best process and how do we find it and optimize it



Veteran college officials have no desire to work in the NBA. Jess Kersey's son Brian is a top notch college official who works Duke-Carolina or Kentucky-LSU as much as he wants. But he has no desire to work the NBA. I guess that's the guys that you're wanting instead of who's being promoted but those guys aren't interested. October to June. No thanks. Go to a camp held by NBA officials. Young guys, not 20 year college vets, trying to make the NBA. NBDL, WNBA, that's who you're complaining about, those that you don't want in the playoffs.


MC - Yep. (Read the article about Brian) i want the best of the best in the NBA, no matter what it takes to get them there. The same thing we try (and i know we arent perfect there either) with players. If Brian is one of the best, how do we recruit him and get him to want to officiate in the NBA. Maybe his insurance business is too good, but we should at least be in a position to have an open process to those who have worked and succeeded in high pressure situation

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by mcuban

kind of like the *** whipping you took on the NBA block/charge rules...

You still bitter JR ?

Bitter? Moi?

Naw, I'm just tired of whiny, cry-baby fanboys like you......

And sick and tired of the NBA too. Used to love the NBA. However.....since the Bad-Boys, Riley's Knicks and right on up to today's spoiled bunch of idiots who can dunk the hell out of the ball but can't do it without taking 4 steps - well, to be quite honest the NBA has become just boring as hell. Get back to me when you can put an all-star team together that can beat Peurto Rico, Italy and Argentina, and maybe can do it with a little class too. You know- "class". "Class" doesn't involve sh!tting all over officials and blaming them every time your team loses a game. I got an idea though. The real Mark Cuban is obviously starved for attention. Put him on tv instead of his Mavericks. Maybe he'll draw better. Maybe I'll watch that too. I sureashell don't watch the NBA anymore.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Bitter? Moi?

Naw, I'm just tired of whiny, cry-baby fanboys like you......

And sick and tired of the NBA too. Used to love the NBA. However.....since the Bad-Boys, Riley's Knicks and right on up to today's spoiled bunch of idiots who can dunk the hell out of the ball but can't do it without taking 4 steps - well, to be quite honest the NBA has become just boring as hell. Get back to me when you can put an all-star team together that can beat Peurto Rico, Italy and Argentina, and maybe can do it with a little class too. You know- "class". "Class" doesn't involve sh!tting all over officials and blaming them every time your team loses a game. I got an idea though. The real Mark Cuban is obviously starved for attention. Put him on tv instead of his Mavericks. Maybe he'll draw better. Maybe I'll watch that too. I sureashell don't watch the NBA anymore.

pssttt...ignore file.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

pssttt...ignore file.

Yeah, you're right. First I say that I'm gonna ignore this fanboy, and then I go ahead and respond to him anyway. He is one of the better trolls we've had around here lately though- gotta give him that.

Can I tell him to **** off before I go?

[Snake~eyes]

Originally Posted by mcuban

- So what you are saying is
1. we dont have the top 60 officials available.
2. If we paid more to start officials with years of college experience who had reached a level of expertise based on the measurement techniques we currently use we could attract better, more qualified officials ? Im for that. In fact, im pushing for that.

As far as being considered "expendable". Could you explain more about that ? Seriously, would like to know more about what you are saying there.

I have talked to many NBA officials, supervisors, former nba officials and what I hear most is that its just not worth it. There are some NCAA officials that could be in the NBA but don't want to because working NBA basketball sucks. You are under large amounts of scrutiny, you are gone 6 (7?) months out of the year, away from any family/friends that you may have. Sure the pay is good but to me its just not worth it, when I can be working a full NCAA schedule, making good money off of a few months out of the year AND I have my regular job which is bringing in my benefits and steady income. Furthermore if I want I can take any day off from officiating basketball, all i have to do is scratch it and I'm good to go. Probably no such system, after hearing NBA officials talk about how they miss their kids birthdays, tball games, christmas...yadyadyada it just doesn't seem worth it to me. Why put yourself through it?

Also I think the basketball sucks, if we took out pay and travel and all that crap. And I just was picking the game to officiate (NBA or NCAA) then I would take a D1 college game. I really don't like the NBA game, I don't watch much NBA during the year, only the playoffs pretty much. And that's only because I like to watch the officials mainly.

Seriously, who wants to go to Dallas and have to listen to you yelling in their face? It's like you want good officials yet you yell and scream at them. Why do I want that? Explain to me what's so good about being an NBA official?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Yeah, you're right. First I say that I'm gonna ignore this fanboy, and then I go ahead and respond to him anyway. He is one of the better trolls we've had around here lately though- gotta give him that.

Can I tell him to **** off before I go?

No you can't.

Look at it this way: when you go to the zoo & see a monkey up in a tree screeching and wanking off do you tell him to **** off? No you don't, because you realize that it's just some fool monkey screeching & wanking off in a tree because it makes him feel important.

You just kinda laugh at the fool monkey in the tree and wander off to see the tigers.

No different here my friend.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

No you can't.

Look at it this way: when you go to the zoo & see a monkey up in a tree screeching and wanking off do you tell him to **** off? No you don't, because you realize that it's just some fool monkey screeching & wanking off in a tree because it makes him feel important.

You just kinda laugh at the fool monkey in the tree and wander off to see the tigers.

No different here my friend.

OK.

I saw M&M up in a tree once screeching and wanking off. It was in his front yard. I told him to **** off. I was wrong. Next time I'll just laugh at him and say "O, just another Cubs fan".

Thank you, O Wise One.....

[Kajun Ref N Texas]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Bitter? Moi?

Naw, I'm just tired of whiny, cry-baby fanboys like you......

And sick and tired of the NBA too. Used to love the NBA. However.....since the Bad-Boys, Riley's Knicks and right on up to today's spoiled bunch of idiots who can dunk the hell out of the ball but can't do it without taking 4 steps - well, to be quite honest the NBA has become just boring as hell. Get back to me when you can put an all-star team together that can beat Peurto Rico, Italy and Argentina, and maybe can do it with a little class too. You know- "class". "Class" doesn't involve sh!tting all over officials and blaming them every time your team loses a game. I got an idea though. The real Mark Cuban is obviously starved for attention. Put him on tv instead of his Mavericks. Maybe he'll draw better. Maybe I'll watch that too. I sureashell don't watch the NBA anymore.

"Class?" Really, you're going to lecture someone on "class?"

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by mcuban

- So what you are saying is
1. we dont have the top 60 officials available.

Mark,

Some of the best officials in the country are working HS games only. Not everyone is interested in making the jump to work college or pro. It takes a lot of sacrifice to make those jumps and there are not enough slots for everyone that you or I would consider to be the best.

Originally Posted by mcuban

2. If we paid more to start officials with years of college experience who had reached a level of expertise based on the measurement techniques we currently use we could attract better, more qualified officials ? Im for that. In fact, im pushing for that.

Why would someone that makes 6 figures working basketball, then another 6 figures working their regular job want to take around $80,000 and with very little job security? A lot of college officials have very good jobs and work college basketball. They get to control their own schedule (they are independent contractors). They get to right a lot of their expenses off their taxes (because it is their business to officiate) and if you have gotten to the level of a Ed Hightower, Steve Welmer or Jim Burr, you are more known in the officiating community than most of the NBA staff. Why would someone want to give all those things up so they can work a year or two in the NBA and if they make one call you do not like, they will not have a job the following year. Now do not get me wrong there is a lot of money at stake at the college level and officials can lose their jobs there, but there are many more games around the country to work and if one conference does not want an official, there are others they can work for. If the NBA does not like you, there is no other place to go at that level.

Originally Posted by mcuban

- As far as being considered "expendable". Could you explain more about that ? Seriously, would like to know more about what you are saying there.

Look Mark (if this is really you) you have done nothing but complain about the officiating and the system the entire time you have been in the league. You have complained publicly about the staff and I am sure you have voiced your concerns about specific officials to the league. You claimed that certain officials were up to a standard and others were not. Now if you get rid of those guys, where do they have to go? You expect these officials that have never worked a single college game (which is the case with some of the NBA staff) to all of a sudden pick up games at the D1 level? The NBA game is a different game. Many of the officials that got to the NBA did not through HS, college than the NBA to work the NBA. It is not how the NBA chooses officials and is a reason you do not see a lot of officials trying to work NBA games.

Mark you seem like a bright guy and you have made a lot of money in business. Officiating is not like other businesses you have been involved in. Not everyone has the time or energy to work the NBA as an official. Even if you picked a guy that worked just HS, they would have to completely learn the NBA way because the mechanics, rules and philosophies are completely different and would take years to get a hold of as an official. It is a big jump for some of us to when we work a HS game as compared to a small college basketball game. I just do not think you understand the system and if you think you are going to have a NBA officiating staff of the very top 60 then you are not being realistic. Many of the officials that could work the NBA eliminate themselves from working the NBA.

Peace

[Raymond]

Could you please post the link to this forum on your web page?

thanks.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Kajun Ref N Texas

"Class?" Really, you're going to lecture someone on "class?"

Yup, and you Dallas fanboys have got absolutely NO class. You all whine like little babies. The damn game was over last week and you're still moaning and pissing about it You really need to get a damn life, fanboy.

[Kajun Ref N Texas]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Yup, and you Dallas fanboys have got absolutely NO class. You all whine like little babies. The damn game was over last week and you're still moaning and pissing about it You really need to get a damn life, fanboy.

Do you remember that anger management class we discussed earlier...

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Kajun Ref N Texas

Do you remember that anger management class we discussed earlier...

Got news for you...I ain't mad at all. Just got no use for whiny fanboys, and I got even less use for people who say they are officials and should have enough professionalism to know better.

Now, keep on doing what you do best. Think you can keep up your whining and crying right through to the start of next season? Go for it, fanboy.