Dealing with uncooperative partner

[assignmentmaker]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

Assignors will do that? If I allowed officials to X potential partners, it would be all over. Do you have any idea how much people don't like each other? And, if they do now, just wait a while . . . [/B]

Uh yeah, assignors will do that. Why put people together that don't get along or don't like each other? It never makes for a well officiated game. If an assignor is stuck though, he might still put them together if needed.

Assignors usually don't allow any of their officials to x out any potential partners, but part of the assignor's job certainly is to try and get the right combination of personalities together out there. Keeping incompatible people away from each other when you're assigning crews isn't really a biggie. [/B][/QUOTE]

I agree.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
If you are completely incompatible with a certain official, then I don't blame you one bit for not wanting to work with him/her. It's not a good situation for yourself or anybody else, including the teams involved.

Agreed.

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
The problem is though that you have to give up those assignments if you do it the way you mentioned.

There are TONNES of games to do around here. Not getting that one Varsity game a year or the Juvenile semi doesn't bother me.

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
What would happen if you had a heart-to-heart with your assignor instead of just turning down an assignment?

That's a good way to handle it. However, if you were to ever meet my assignor... well... nepitism runs high. Don't get me wrong - I benefit form it at times - the mood seems to change all the time. In fact, I even dual with a nearby board to get away from the poop that is here.

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Jmo, but I think that any reasonable and competent assignor should know his officials and also know who to put together- or keep apart- to get the best game results. The assignor should also try to find out why an official doesn't want to work with another official. If it's just a personality or philosophical clash between two officials, then it's really no biggie for the assignor. Just try to keep 'em away from each other- unless you happen to get stuck. If one of the officials is acting like the clown mentioned above in this thread, then the assignor should know about that too- and he should also do something about it when he does find out. You don't want people like that representing your association or driving good officials away. Jmo.

[Texas Aggie]

>> if I have a partner that starts to "get in my face and scream at me", they will only do it one time<<

Don't let them do it at all. There's no point in listening to someone that's screaming -- coach or co-official. I'd pull out my phone right then and there and make a call to the assignment secretary telling him this guy is a real problem that needs to be dealt with.

It is vital that we all build up enough good will with the people that we work with so if this situation happens, your statements regarding it will go unquestioned.

[Back In The Saddle]

Back in my much younger, brasher days when I umpired baseball, I had a partner who felt the need to overrule a call I had made. No discussion, no "hey partner, what did you have on that?", just walked up and said "I'm afraid I'm going to have to overrule you on this one." I wasn't about to put up with that crap, so I walked off and left him to work the rest of the game by himself.

At the time I felt completely justified -- what kind of a man was I if I let this jerk walk all over me? But looking back now I'm kind of horrified by my behavior. I now consider my behavior to be much less professional than his. And being the jerk that he was, I would imagine that he told the story to everybody who would listen -- spun his way, of course. I'm sure that did wonders for my reputation.

The lesson I've taken from that is that it's probably better to suffer the fool in as professional a manner as I can muster. Otherwise I risk damaging my own reputation.

[SavaahnTy]

My mother always taught me that you can learn something from EVERYONE, no matter who they are.

You have now learned to treat your partner with respect, or end up looking like your partner for those contests.

You have learned the well placed advice of trusting your partner to take care of his....and and if you get into another situation where you KNOW that he ( whomever your partner may be ) can't... its time to step your game up and begin looking at the game from a different prespective: as crew cheif. Just make sure your secondary/out of area calls are OBVIOUS/SIGNIFICANT, and/or they ABSOLUTELY need to be called.....would be my advice.

Personally, I try to use even the lowest level of summer ball to sharpen my game for the season, and from what I have been taught, allowing O/S things to occur in a game without calling them simply for the fact that they are not in your primary may not be the best habit to get into.

I have to say that if you were my partner, I would have appreciated the look on the oob if I had missed it or was unsure... because it gives me an opportunity to take care of mine instead of giving any perception of " is he gonna make all the calls for you tonight? " and other subtle challenges offered by coaches during the game.

Good luck

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by SavaahnTy
(1) My mother always taught me that you can learn something from EVERYONE, no matter who they are.

(2) Personally, I try to use even the lowest level of summer ball to sharpen my game for the season, and from what I have been taught, allowing O/S things to occur in a game without calling them simply for the fact that they are not in your primary may not be the best habit to get into.

(1) Your mother has obviously never met Dan_Ref.

(2)Jmo, but I don't think that consistently calling things out of your primary isn't really the best habit to get into either. There's a reason for having "primaries". The reason is that the official responsible for that particular primary is supposed to have the best view of what's happening in that primary.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

(1) Your mother has obviously never met Dan_Ref.

[socalreff]

What no one has mentioned in all this is that in 2 man the post call from the trail when the ball is in lead's corner is the TRAIL's primary, NOT the lead's. Obviously, the lead does not know coverages if he thought it was his call. Why hasn't anbody talked about this? If I knew my partner was a 2nd year official, I would put him in the know about coverage areas depending on where the ball is. Since we teach this exact play in our unit, our guys probably would know it already.

[Nevadaref]

Originally posted by socalreff
What no one has mentioned in all this is that in 2 man the post call from the trail when the ball is in lead's corner is the TRAIL's primary, NOT the lead's. Obviously, the lead does not know coverages if he thought it was his call. Why hasn't anbody talked about this? If I knew my partner was a 2nd year official, I would put him in the know about coverage areas depending on where the ball is. Since we teach this exact play in our unit, our guys probably would know it already.

No one has mentioned it because that's not right according to Diagram 7 on the top of page 24 in the 2003-05 NFHS Officials Manual.

I fully expect the Trail to help on the back side of the FT lane (opposite block), but making calls on the near block is not recommended.

[ChrisSportsFan]

Originally posted by socalreff
What no one has mentioned in all this is that in 2 man the post call from the trail when the ball is in lead's corner is the TRAIL's primary, NOT the lead's. Obviously, the lead does not know coverages if he thought it was his call. Why hasn't anbody talked about this? If I knew my partner was a 2nd year official, I would put him in the know about coverage areas depending on where the ball is. Since we teach this exact play in our unit, our guys probably would know it already.

Maybe I don't understand what you are saying but I interpret that you are suggesting that the trail reach all the way across the court to the leads corner to make a call?? If that's what you're saying, you might have missed something when your board was teaching that because I'm pretty sure that's not what they said.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by ChrisSportsFan

Maybe I don't understand what you are saying but I interpret that you are suggesting that the trail reach all the way across the court to the leads corner to make a call?? If that's what you're saying, you might have missed something when your board was teaching that because I'm pretty sure that's not what they said.

I don't think that's what he's saying. He's saying that when the ball is in the lead's corner, that the trail must watch the post players, even if the post players are on L's side of the lane.

I agree.

The "primary areas" determine who watches the ball, and the defender(s) nearest the ball, and any on-ball screens, etc. The other official(s) watch(es) everything else.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Nevadaref

No one has mentioned it because that's not right according to Diagram 7 on the top of page 24 in the 2003-05 NFHS Officials Manual.

I fully expect the Trail to help on the back side of the FT lane (opposite block), but making calls on the near block is not recommended.

Diagram 7 on page 4 notwithstanding, if the L is referee'ing the play in the corner on his side who is left to referee the rest of the floor, which includes both low posts btw.

[crack-it]

on the call down low, i wouldn't make the call when out of my area unless the bump caused an advantage. if it did, you gotta go get the foul. if not, let it pass.
sounds like the guy was embarrassed about missing some calls and took it out on you.

avoid working with the guy if you can.

[Camron Rust]

As others have said...the diagrams only detail who covers the ball. If your not on ball, you cover the players away from the ball without regard to the diagrams.

[Edited by Camron Rust on Aug 25th, 2005 at 12:32 PM]

[SeanFitzRef]

Originally posted by Camron Rust
As others have said...the diagrams only detail who covers the ball. If you not on ball, you cover the players away from the ball without regard to the diagrams.

And if the T closes down, like he should, he isn't making the call from the sideline, and it looks more believable!