Wrong team awarded AP throw-in

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by bucky

"Middle schools almost never have alternating possession arrows at the table."

Agree, I find it hard to believe that it is rare that a MS table has an arrow. Do these same schools also have scoreboards without an A/P indicator.

And if there actually is not physical A/P device one can be configured in about 3 seconds or less. Just draw an arrow on a sheet of paper or, just use a pen/pencil, shoe, stapler, or anything else as your arrow. Sure those items can get dislodged/bumped but scorer should be recording it anyway. Additionally, the chances of a McGyver-made arrow getting moved at the table are as remote as the school not having one in the first place. Lastly, each official should be, in their own respective way, recording the A/P arrow, especially when at these school which are known to not have one.

What BillyMac says of middle school tables is true in my area as well. Also, most of the scoreboards are old and either do not show possession or the operator has no clue how to post it.

I completely disagree with your statement that the officials should be recording the arrow. By rule, that is not our responsibility. If the scorer fails to track individual or team fouls, do you want the officials to keep those totals as well? Stop putting everything on the officials and let the other personnel handle their duties.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

What BillyMac says of middle school tables is true in my area as well. Also, most of the scoreboards are old and either do not show possession or the operator has no clue how to post it.

I completely disagree with your statement that the officials should be recording the arrow. By rule, that is not our responsibility. If the scorer fails to track individual or team fouls, do you want the officials to keep those totals as well? Stop putting everything on the officials and let the other personnel handle their duties.

How much brain power does it take to remember the arrow? Seriously, it's not that hard and it prevents problems when you have tables that are less than stellar.

Guess what, I also keep track of team fouls, either by checking the scoreboard every time a foul is called or simply keeping track in my head.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Raymond

How much brain power does it take to remember the arrow? Seriously, it's not that hard and it prevents problems when you have tables that are less than stellar.

Guess what, I also keep track of team fouls, either by checking the scoreboard every time a foul is called or simply keeping track in my head.

I do the same thing as you and have been told by HS officials that it's "not our job."

[bob jenkins]

It's harder to continue to do at a MS game -- especially if it's girls and if you work two (or more) in a row.

Some of the games have more held balls than points (or so it seems)

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

It's harder to continue to do at a MS game -- especially if it's girls and if you work two (or more) in a row. Some of the games have more held balls than points (or so it seems)

Been there. Done that.

I had an odd doubleheader last week. One extremely large middle school, Chippens Hill, is so large that it actually has two boys teams and two girls teams, two called the White Team (listed that way on Arbiter) and two called the Blue Team (reversible jerseys for games that required such).

I had this school's annual end of season intraschool doubleheader. White boys versus Blue boys, followed by White girls versus Blue girls. I guess that there had been an earlier season intraschool game with both White teams being the home teams so in this game both Blue teams (wearing blue jerseys) were the home teams and the site director insisted that it was to be this way on the scoreboard.

I figured, "Why sweat the small stuff, no problem". Famous last words.

Both games were close all the way to the end. Scoreboard watching was important at the end (possible tactical or strategic fouling). Try as I must, I kept on having to ask the crowd, "Who's ahead?".

I had worked several previous games at this site with teams from other schools, so in the back of mind I knew which "school" was the home team, which made it even more confusing.

My head was spinning after the doubleheader.

Earlier in both games I told the crowd, "I've got twenty bucks that says Chippens Hill wins".

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by SC Official

I do the same thing as you and have been told by HS officials that it's "not our job."

I was taught to do so by a high school trainer my first few years in officiating. She would come up to us in camp games during breaks and ask us the score, team fouls, and AP arrow. That person is now a college supervisor for two NCAA-Women's conferences, one D1 and one D2, after serving a few years as a Women's D1 regional observer.

[bucky]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I completely disagree with your statement that the officials should be recording the arrow. By rule, that is not our responsibility. If the scorer fails to track individual or team fouls, do you want the officials to keep those totals as well? Stop putting everything on the officials and let the other personnel handle their duties.

You do? You truly disagree that refs should not record A/P in some way when there isn't one present? Wow, what do you do then, nothing? Do you guess every held ball? Do you ask the coaches? Plus, refs do many things that our not our responsibility "by rule". Keep track of fouls? Of course not as it is too difficult to manage for most, but recording the A/P is easy and prevents far more headaches than foul counts. The premise is a MS game and letting most personnel (BM cited students) handle their duties is ill-advised. In fact, I bet the OP was about a table not handling their duties correctly. It is very likely that the table misinformed the crew. If the refs were recording it correctly, then there likely would not have been the error. Get real Nevada.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

... disagree with your statement that the officials should be recording the arrow.

Originally Posted by bucky

You truly disagree that refs should not record A/P in some way ...

"Recording" is a strong word, and while it's true that the NFHS doesn't require officials to record the alternating possession arrow (it only requires an arrow at the table and a record of "jump balls" (interestingly not held balls, or intermissions, stupid NFHS) in the scorebook), it's probably a good idea that officials have an educated "opinion" when it comes to the correct direction of the alternating possession arrow, be it a memory, a whistle in one's pocket, or an elastic band on one's wrist. This is especially true when there are student scorekeepers and timekeepers at the table.

While a whistle in one's pocket is strongly encouraged (and taught to rookies) here in my little corner of Connecticut (on all levels, including varsity, been doing this since God created the alternating possession arrow on the eighth day), it's not mandatory (but it's pretty close to mandatory, our "Rome thing").